Hey @M0N do you mind giving me a quick run-down on the aqua la voce s3 vs a holo spring?
I intended for the Spring 3 (I know it’s not out yet but it should be pretty close to a May according to Tim) but I see a used aqua for a good price so would appreciate any quick thoughts you might have on their differences…
Thanks! It’s so cool!
Edit: Looks sexy, but $3000. Yiiikes.
So compared to a may kte, I think they are on somewhat equal footing:
The may is more noticeably colored, a bit warmer smoother, the holo is a bit more dry and less tonally dense than the aqua, less soft than the aqua, the holo might have a more holographic sound but the aqua has a more organic spatial recreation (the holo has a larger stage with more sharp placement but it sounds strangely artificial at times in comparison). Generally detail would be similar, the timbre might go to the aqua, in terms of dynamics the holo might be more alive there macro wise but the aqua is more faithful to the recording when it comes to dynamics micro wise. Speed the Holo does feel like it has the edge. Smoothness wise the aqua has better liquidity. When it comes to extension I think the may has a slight edge. For texture I feel the aqua generally provides more texture overall although the May may have an edge in subbass texture.
Touching on stage a bit more, on the holo is more expansive and wider reaching, sounds more 3d in general, but I think the aqua does a few key things better: representation of empty space/nothingness between instruments, the sizing of instruments and dynamics in that stage, and more accurately adapting it’s stage to meet what was recorded in the recording. To touch on the nothingness factor, the space between the instruments is semi audible on the may if that makes sense, things are well separated in their place, but you can just feel like there is something between there, where with the aqua, it doesn’t have that so things seem more natural. The holo may also doesn’t size instruments as well, they can either sound a bit similar size when they shouldn’t be, like a trumpet can feel almost as large as a tuba, which really shouldn’t be the case, so the aqua does a better job at accurately sizing those instruments. And then also the holo can sometimes sound artificially large and deep which is fun, but it will generally not adapt it’s stage to better match the recording, which the aqua does, if you have something recorded in a small room, it can sound overly large on the holo and it more sounds like a smaller room on the aqua. The holo does give a bit more out of head stage but it really comes at the cost of sounding as realistic as the aqua
So generally both are very solid, depends on synergy and preference. Holo is more energetic and holographic, auqa is more organic and nuanced, both pretty technical, neither will disappoint
It’s cool but imo pretty lackluster at that price unfortunately (nice detail and control and grip and reasonably neutral, but lackluster timbre, meh spatial recreation, and limited dynamics for the price). Great crossfeed though and it does look sweet
A thought here @M0N which has nothing to do with sound and everything to do with the hobby and being able to resell stuff you purchase in case it didn’t mesh well.
That’s the big value I see in what you’re doing/done here. A lot of the foundational commentary is good, since we often aren’t going to get it elsewhere. (popular you tubers don’t tend to do reviews on these brands) and you’ve been a good constant in the way you’ve described differences when comparing DACs.
Anyway, back to my point, there are some devices/brands that are safe purchases. Meaning you’re not going to take a bath reselling them and that sell quick, often in less than a week of posting. Then there are others that although of the same tier or caliber, simply sit or lag and it’s not always because of their capability. It’s hard to put a finger as to what/why the delineation happens but it’s an organic process that feels a little herd like in mentality. Not that there’s anything wrong with that. lol
Just that if you do research, there are quality items that will decrease in value a lot more and you’ll have a better shot at negotiating prices down because they’ve sat for a month or two but comparisons like these help us to be educated about purchasing those. Knowing what you’re getting into before you purchase it is half the battle.
Yep, some dacs at this point are real bargains on the used market compared to others (at the time of writing) that have either been dismissed as old, aren’t hyped by the current market but still hold up, or are a bit more synergy dependent that are still extremely viable (or people don’t even know about them in the first place lol). You take a bit of a gamble buying one of these more uncommon dacs resale wise, mainly since it’s not easy to flip quick and typically takes time and attractive pricing on the used market, you have to find a buyer who actually knows. Take for example a berkeley alpha series 2, a 5k dac from 2012, still competes in the same price bracket today (was still sold up until 2020 unchanged for 5k as well) and now they go for like 2k, real good deal. That being said it does require a nice ddc, and with some amps synergy would be hit or miss, but it’s one of those things that shouldn’t be ignored simply due to age and less market hype. Whereas 2k is like the same price you might pay for a spring 2k kte if you could even find one in the first place, and the series 2 would smack that up lol. But that being said the spring 2 kte is much more easily flipped, and less synergy dependent and doesn’t require an extra ddc. So tradeoffs
There are a ton of excellent dacs out there, what I have mentioned so far is only a small group of some of those dacs I have liked enough to own, there are many many more great dacs out there. It’s just hard to find info on some of them that would lead someone to be comfortable enough to actually buy so most typically pass on the more uncommon dacs. That being said, there’s also some real meh or bad dacs laying around too, and it can be really hard to differentiate if you don’t know
Thank you that was really helpful!
Never heard of Aqua before this thread…lol
I saw on the website about it being modular and that seemed pretty interesting.
It looks like I might prefer this aqua piece…is it relatively hard to synergize with (using a Soloist 3xp)?
Yeah upgradable overtime is always appealing
I think it would have great synergy with a soloist 3xp imo. As long as you don’t mind it being fairly neutral (personally I like to inject a bit more warmth and relaxed nature into the 3xp but the aqua would imo still be a very solid match)
Did you test the aqua on usb mostly (which is how I’ll be using it)?
It seems like nothing “special” was done to the usb input according to their website, so I was thinking maybe it might not sound as good on usb vs its other inputs…
Yes
It does scale with a nicer ddc or streamer, but I wouldn’t complain about using it via usb either
I use mine on USB occasionally, it’s a good USB implementation.
There is a slight win with something like a pi2AES or better streamer via AES (if the one your looking at has it)
R2R DACs like the aqua and holo are NOS by nature, right?
I ask this because the May has some upsampling features (not that you’d want to use it from what I’ve heard) which had me wondering.
Not all R2R DAC’s are NOS, but the Aqua is and the Holo lets you switch OS on or off.
Ah, I see thanks!
Out of curiosity, what are some R2R DACs that OS?
Anything using any of the older Burr Brown R2R chips will oversample, I’m not sure it can even be disabled. And anything with a user selectable output filter.
If it doesn’t claim NOS on the tin it probably isn’t.
Pretty much the easiest way to tell
Some more examples of oversampling r2r would be like rockna products, soekris products, etc. There are a lot with switchable nos/os like totaldac and others
Would some Hegel DACs be worth mentioning in your DAC shootout @M0N?
I think D30 would be in that price range…
To me they’ve always been on the “It’s ok” side of things for me, I don’t think they are stand out in any real way, wouldn’t really be my first choice. I guess unremarkable would be the word considering the price
