(update in progress) Falenkor's Competitive Headphone Write Up. Now with added Hardware explanations!

[Falenkor]

@Javigdlv

i though the 560s was the perfect headphone based on reviews, i dont have the chance to hear them first where i live so i just have to rely on that, i saw the video linked early in the thread about the Pro gamer doing a vs and he put it on top, and others reviewers too speak very well of the headphone, besides the neutral signature of the headphone makes them good to hear microsounds as the bass is nonexistant. Buut dont like its design tho…

While its not a bad headphone its also not completely neutral as the treble is pushed up a little on it. The signature does fit into the competitive gamer category well enough it just lacks in soundstage. It’s by no means bad but I wouldn’t say its the best or at the top of the list.

@Javigdlv

For what are you saying the 560s is not that good of an option so if i were to buy a headphone with excellent imaging and okey soundstage in the 200 bracket what would be your choice? i mean i want 2 options 1 budget to 200$ and other to 500ish so if the improve worth it i go for the better.

youd have to compare with 3 headphones…

560s relatively average staging and imaging but a good well rounded reference grade headphone just with tones of brightness in it.

one of the hifimans like the 400se which is getting some popularity. personally haven’t got to this… but headphones like sundara in the higher price brackets are quite nice

the beyers… beyers are known for large soundstage and extremely accurate imaging but they tend to be extremely bright to the point of being unusable for some people

personally itd be for senneheiser the 560s and 660s and for beyer itd be a toss up… 880, 990, or tygr and upgraded would just be 1990 or T1 2nd gen

@Javigdlv

I did more reseach and i think to me its more important the Imaging to be able to ping point enemies even in tarkov, because even is the map are larger than the usual map of cs or valorant most of the fights are close quarter and moving between rooms, so i prefer the best imaging obviously without losing too much soundstage.

depends on the player honestly… but for the most part yeah imaging is one of the most important aspects… the sennheisers will work fine with 660s being the better option. Beyers will be built sturdier and have better staging alongside very good imaging in terms of technicalities they tend to be a bit more superior.

@Javigdlv

I like the signature of the 660s for music and it has excellent imaging i though it could serve both purpose.

never said it couldn’t the problem is tarkov

@Javigdlv

on the other hand there is the 1990 pro that i know its really good for gaming but to be honest im afraid that with more soundstage i will lose imaging and it will be hard to hear where the sound is coming from exactly when im close to an enemy.

1990 is quite well known to have a large soundstage accompanied by extremely accurate imaging placements… its designed to tear apart and pick out flaws as an analytical headphone. It does its job extremely well and in gaming theres a reason I give it high praise… its practically a monster and completely overkill for most games. Most games in fps cannot use its entire soundstage though the very accurate imaging is still very nice… of course there is bigger soundstage headphones but the 1990 is plenty big enough for the usual needs… its just not going to be as good as like a sundara or gl2k or something for staging.

@Javigdlv

proper amp ( i have a little dot 1+ its an hybrid amp i did opam swamp and really cool tubes the gold sylvanas, as a dac i have 2 a MOTU 2 and a schiit Bifrost Uber. not sure if its enough to drive the 1990 pro.

would highly recommend getting a regular solid state, tubes warmth isn’t the best choice for competitive. Though as for the little dot, not sure on that one never bothered with those you’d need clarification from others who have sat with it on what it can power. Dacs are technically alright

@Javigdlv

hows your T1 in Imaging?? just curious it could change my plans to buy a budget Headphone and save for the t1 instead of the midrange

I chose to stick with my T1 over my 1990 as i preferred its relaxed wider signature over the 1990. The 1990 is very aggressive and in your face with a very bright signature… while the T1 is very bright its much more relaxed so to me its a bit more enjoyable… though 1990 signature is more flexible I also have bigger ears so the curved drivers of the T1 suit me better as my ears don’t lay against the drivers. As far as imaging between the two I would say 1990 edges out in front but T1 has the better staging. The imaging is more marginal and I have very little issues if at all placing sounds on my T1.2. Both can change their signature qutie well its just that 1990 is more neutral and so changing anything with it flips the signature every which way making it have more sound capabilities. T1 though is also a 600 ohm headphone while 1990 is 250 ohm… t1 needs quite a lot of power and is fairly picky when it comes to its amp and dac responding very well to tube amps and higher end amps it scales to a very large degree. Kind of a flip of the coin on which one will prefer however, T1 2nd gen is harder to get now that its been discontinued… used market wise though 1990 and t1 2nd are the same price usually at $400

[Javigdlv]

@Falenkor Thanks man for the dedicated response once again,
so the decision then its about getting a 660s cheap enough maybe used on ebay or in headfi or the 560s new, and then upgrade to 1990 pro with a proper amp and dekoni velour pads., from what are you saying i will like more the 1990 pro signature than the t1 and easier to drive and find in market.

final question, about separation between my options that i think its important too because if there is soundstage and imaging but poor separation it will blend all the noise. which one its better

[ChoppingBoard]

Hi Falenkor.

Great write up! The amount of insight and knowledge you have is astounding. What’s more impressive is your continued willingness and dedication to share it with us plebs.

I’ve created an account on here, just like a few others, just to ask for your help. I am not an audiophile. And I have close to zero knowledge in the field of sound equipment. (I have only watched a dozen review videos on headphones and amp/dacs on YouTube)

So I am looking for a pair of headphones for gaming. With the following things in mind:

Desired use case: This will only be for the purposes of playing Hunt: Showdown. Given the constraints below, I want to be able place explosions, gunshots, bullet and projectile whizes. I want to hear foot steps and branches cracking and be able to tell where and how far/close they are.

Constraints:
Budget: USD $200
Are closed backs
Comfortable to wear for up to 4 hrs. straight
Doesn’t have to be portable or capable of wireless
No need for mic

So based from your exchange with user nyj585 in this same thread above, I want to give the DT 770 a try.

I’m thinking of getting the 250ohm version. That means I’ll have to get a dac and amp combo. For this, I only have USD $80 (I really don’t want to stretch this). I’ve done some googling and found these 3 dac/amps within the price range:

FX Audio dac-x6 (the older version and not the mkII)
Fiio e10k Olympus 2
SMSL M3

However, based on additional digging, the latter two might not be enough to power the 250ohm DT 770.

So my quandary is:
A. should I go with a dac and amp combo that’s less than $80 with the DT 770 250; or
B. Go for 80ohm version and a < $80 amp/dac;
C. Just get another pair of closed backs on your list? (and if so which one)

What are your thoughts? Thank you very much.

[Falenkor]

@Javigdlv

so the decision then its about getting a 660s cheap enough maybe used on ebay or in headfi or the 560s new

you see 660s up for sale quite often since they are an older headphone… 560s being still under a year old is less common but seen every now and then.

@Javigdlv

1990 pro with a proper amp and dekoni velour pads., from what are you saying i will like more the 1990 pro signature than the t1 and easier to drive and find in market.

eh if you prefer the more aggressive signature yea… they are quite a bit different in how they represent sound… while I really like the 1990s I fell in love with my T1s

@Javigdlv

final question, about separation between my options that i think its important too because if there is soundstage and imaging but poor separation it will blend all the noise. which one its better

so the more narrow intimate sounds of sennheiser will cause the sounds to appear much closer to one another and to you though the sennheisers separate their sounds just fine just that they don’t put as much space as the beyers. Both do just fine in terms of separation so its not really a concern in those particular headphones.

@ChoppingBoard

Given the constraints below, I want to be able place explosions, gunshots, bullet and projectile whizes. I want to hear foot steps and branches cracking and be able to tell where and how far/close they are.

simply put this is just imaging and soundstage together… imaging is how accurately your able to place a sound and soundstage is how far away.

@ChoppingBoard

Constraints:
Budget: USD $200
Are closed backs
Comfortable to wear for up to 4 hrs. straight
Doesn’t have to be portable or capable of wireless
No need for mic

So based from your exchange with user nyj585 in this same thread above, I want to give the DT 770 a try.

I would say the same, the 770 sounds most ideal in this particular case. The only issue with 770s is that they are a bit on the power demanding side of things so you do want to make sure you have an ample amount of power… otherwise the headphone has quite the many issues… the other thing is it has a bit too much in the bass, especially if you swap to leather pads as it naturally comes with velour… you can fix the bass through some simple EQ or an eq profile like scout mode on the g6 amp but its something to keep note of… Personally, I have no issues using 770 but it did take me a bit of time to get acclimated to its V shaped signature. If your a fan of vocals in music though it may not be the best idea as they are recessive

@ChoppingBoard

I’m thinking of getting the 250ohm version. That means I’ll have to get a dac and amp combo. For this, I only have USD $80 (I really don’t want to stretch this). I’ve done some googling and found these 3 dac/amps within the price range:

hmm, I would recommend stretching that budget a bit… think of your amp and dac as an investment for the future… somewhere down the line you will probably think to yourself what if I wanted to take my headphones to the next step… well depending on your choice later it could be even more power demanding… they aren’t too expensive so to speak though either… can get a g6 off the market for like $100 and that powers the 600 ohm beyers

@ChoppingBoard

FX Audio dac-x6 (the older version and not the mkII)

older version to my knowledge barely powers the 250 ohm 770… itll be lackluster on the volume and it may not have a complete signature.

@ChoppingBoard

Fiio e10k Olympus 2

this while yes it will power them… again it does struggle… 250 ohm beyers is the maximum for this unit and even then it wont get them fully “loud” with much headroom if any at all.

@ChoppingBoard

SMSL M3

I do not recommend smsl for beyers… they tend to make them a bit brighter and cause sibilance

@ChoppingBoard

So my quandary is:
A. should I go with a dac and amp combo that’s less than $80 with the DT 770 250; or
B. Go for 80ohm version and a < $80 amp/dac;
C. Just get another pair of closed backs on your list? (and if so which one)

What are your thoughts? Thank you very much.

well, I will say instead… search the used markets. The 770s are a very old headphone as such you can easily find them in practically brand new condition for very cheap… the cheapest I snagged a 770 for was $85. You can typically grab one of those for $100 which would leave you enough cash to just snag the soundblaster G6 or fiio k5 pro. Now, mind you those amps aren’t particularly audiophile sound quality… they will just get the job done… not to say that they are bad but there is of course better down the road… though I would say g6 does pretty well as a dac later on if you decide to amp upgrade… I would say the g6 in this regard as its compatibility with the new gen consoles is unique on the market right now only a few others have this, it has a built in equalizer program thats pretty easy to use honestly, voice morph if thats your thing for 3.5mm mics, powers up to 600 ohm beyers(note software must be utilized to achieve this by placing it into its high gain mode post update of the firmware), 7.1 dolby if again thats your thing, and recon mode which is an eq preset that emphasizes footstep and fps placement. You can find g6 usually mint at roughly $100 give or take… I would recommend that route this way you have a bit of future proofing and you get the best case result in this budget. Once thats done you can just call it a day.

as for 770s… if you never used a beyer… they are built extremely well and 770s are comfortable as hell once broken in. Though, the pads may need changed out(they are $40) which is a thing every year or two depending on how heavily you use them… You can get dekonis velour that will last much longer(same price) but they do alter the signature a little bit.

How to search the used markets: We have a buy/sell looking for thread here on hifiguides, head-fi has its own buy/sell area, ebay is always nice, and lastly you can use a site called HIFISHARK to scour the webs multiple sites and dig up results from many other sites such as places like reddit and its avexchange. If your buying third party… use paypal. Ask them for proof of ownership by having a post card in the picture of the item with their username, time, and date and then request that they send a paypal invoice… this way if anything is wrong with the item paypal will cover you with buyer protection and you can avoid any scams.

[givemebeer]

@ChoppingBoard

That means I’ll have to get a dac and amp combo. For this, I only have USD $80 (I really don’t want to stretch this).

I’d hunt for a used JDS Labs Atom and grab a $9 Apple USB C dongle for a DAC with that budget.

[Falenkor]

I definitely wouldn’t… atoms fine but the dac is just… meh

[Falenkor]

if anybody has any other questions for me feel free to ask and I will get back to you at earliest convenience you can message me on here, through your own respective thread, or directly messaging me on hifiguides through the use of the private messaging system.

as for when the update will be to this guide? soon actually… I am almost done with it and working on finishing up a few rewrites and adding a few headphones here and there that I sat down with recently. Those wondering about the 400se from hifiman… no, I have not gotten around to that not sure if I will anytime soon due to busy scheduling. Thinking of taking a small break from testing out new equipment.

[Javigdlv]

ok @Falenkor Thanks again, so do you think a 660s for 250-300$ its a better deal for gaming than 560s? for the endgame i will go for the 1990 pro with all the toys, i believe it will be a nice complement for the 660s or 560s to cover alot of music genre.

in other topic; the Sundaras, for a moment i though that it was the perfect headphone but then i saw in many places that plannars doesnt work verywell in fps gaming, i dont want bass that bloat the sound when a granade hits or an explotion happens, i want to keep hearing the ambient with all of that happening at the same time, or if im fighting someone, hear a third party coming from another place. maybe im wrong and theyre amazing for gaming, i know it has soundstage and a really good imaging, but im not sure if the eq of the headphone its for gaming.

[Falenkor]

@Javigdlv

Thanks again, so do you think a 660s for 250-300$ its a better deal for gaming than 560s? for the endgame i will go for the 1990 pro with all the toys, i believe it will be a nice complement for the 660s or 560s to cover alot of music genre.

560s have better soundstage… both are good though, pick your preference on that. As for price wise… yeah thats not bad at all considering a 660s is a $500 headphone

@Javigdlv

i saw in many places that plannars doesnt work verywell in fps gaming

whoever has bothered to make a comment that planars are bad for fps has no idea what they are talking about and should probably educate themselves. There is nothing wrong with a planar driver being used for fps gaming… sundara, ananda, especially arya, aeons, lcd-x, lcd-gx, some cases of t50rp’s mods like dekoni blue are alright, among others all work just fine… all with varying differences.

@Javigdlv

i dont want bass that bloat the sound when a granade hits or an explotion happens

planars do not bloat the sound… grenades only will be in the way when theres too much warmth or rather bass in the mix… headphones like the argon for example that for some reason some people that have come here have been recommended are bass cannons and absolutely dreadful for fps gaming

@Javigdlv

i know it has soundstage and a really good imaging, but im not sure if the eq of the headphone its for gaming.

as someone who has sat with a wide variety of planars… they have no issues take that one from me. However, planars are power demanding and can definitely sound like trash if improperly powered. Planars have a wide variety of signatures just like dynamics… but they present sound differently tending to have much more speed and slam…

[Javigdlv]

@Falenkor so your saying that the sundaras are really in competition against 560s/1990 pro/660s for soundstage imaging and separation?? for fps gaming. i know that they are well rounded, but focusing on just fps do you think it can deliver??

which amp do you think its a proper amp for the Sundaras

[Falenkor]

@Javigdlv

so your saying that the sundaras are really in competition against 560s/1990 pro/660s for soundstage imaging and separation??

against a 1990? absolutely no

sundaras have a lot of soundstage to them and passably average imaging with very good separation of sound… 660s are more accurate but as said previously they are very narrow and 560 is the other well rounded alternative with average soundstage slightly above average imaging and a more balanced signature to it. Sundara is a bright headphone with recessive bass tones…

the biggest issue with sundaras is the quality control problems with the company hifiman… they have a lot of bad feedback as the headphones have been known to just be straight up defective or blow themselves apart for little reasoning outside of poor sodering or assembly… I have had 3 that have died which makes hifiman a bit hard to recommend… but the sundara itself provided it is a good working copy are a fantastic set of cans… I would take my beyers over them yeah but I do own the Arya, sundaras most expensive big brother above the Ananda, for good reason…

@Javigdlv

which amp do you think its a proper amp for the Sundaras

any of the entry levels work fine for them… g6 will work but seems to kill a lot of the clarity the sundara like to offer making them sound off or dull and lacking dynamically. Its probably outside the budget… I would recommend trying sundara at a later point in time if you can get around to one once you have a proper amp and dac setup.

its typically a better idea to buy hifiman refurbished as these are usually copies of the headphone that have already been repaired and looked at… these seem to have more positive reviews from the consumer.

as for the 400se as said earlier… its getting quite the rave review but I haven’t gotten around to it… could potentially be a good recommendation though im not sure just yet

[Javigdlv]

oh alright so i keep my plan then, 560s/ 660s (660s for more than 300$ not worth it) to upgrade later to a 1990 pro unless i get them used like 400 450.
you scared me with that 3 hifiman dead. its really dificult to send them for warranty to me.

thanks for the help man, its really hard to choose when you cant test them before so you sure what you buying.

anything that i could be missing here? or its a good plan?

btw @Falenkor what amp do you recommend for the dt 1990 pro?

[Jxzo]

Good things here. I’ve made some updates to my overall gear, including updating my headphone amp.

I got a Soundblaster G6 as a secondary device to test the Tempest 3D Audiotech that Sony is hyping up, as they don’t support UAC2 dacs. What I’m wondering is that is this type of setup viable at all:

-Powering the G6 through powered hub/other method.
-PS5 via usb on G6
-Xbox Series X & Other TV sounds via optical in to G6
-Optical out from G6 to my main DAC
-RCA out to Amp.

I know it’s a digital signal and thus wouldn’t have a real difference, but are there any caveats with this passthrough approach? Only use 2.0.

[Falenkor]

@Javigdlv

oh alright so i keep my plan then, 560s/ 660s (660s for more than 300$ not worth it) to upgrade later to a 1990 pro unless i get them used like 400 450.
you scared me with that 3 hifiman dead. its really dificult to send them for warranty to me.

yeah, if you have issues with dealing with potential rma or warranties… I do recommend skipping on a hifiman… I know a lot of people here do swear by the company but I don’t… I have had far too many problems with them to not inform others about their quality issues.

@Javigdlv

thanks for the help man, its really hard to choose when you cant test them before so you sure what you buying.

I do wish there was a way for people to try before buying when it comes to this stuff… it really would help its just that most people dont live near audio stores and the like that provide these kinds of things. I happen to live near 3 stores that carry alot of the brands not to mention the pro gamer background so I get around rather easily

@Javigdlv

anything that i could be missing here? or its a good plan?

not particularly… it sounds like a solid plan… 660 and 1990 both work exceptionally well however both will need an amp. I am not a fan of the sennheisers as like I said… the comfort is a miss for me… the oval cups are very small and are practically on ear for me instead of over ear… which pushes me away from them. No issues with 1990s other than I will say that they are obscenely bright and not for everyone… oh and out of the box new 1990s head clamp as well as sennheiser are just dreadful… you will want to stretch them out over their box or like a foam cube or something for atleast a couple of days especially the sennheiser.

@Javigdlv

btw @Falenkor what amp do you recommend for the dt 1990 pro?

depends on budget… any of the entry levels will do within the $200 price point… you can still stick with a g6 its just not the best audiophile quality… ideally I would say something like a schiit asgard 3 or if that isnt available then lake people amps or maybe a geshelli would work fine… donald dac would be potentially the more extreme case dac for a competitive gamer but I couldn’t care less on that… I would rather suggest someone take the other part of their stack or like a topping e30

@Jxzo

-Powering the G6 through powered hub/other method.
-PS5 via usb on G6
-Xbox Series X & Other TV sounds via optical in to G6
-Optical out from G6 to my main DAC
-RCA out to Amp.

I know it’s a digital signal and thus wouldn’t have a real difference, but are there any caveats with this passthrough approach? Only use 2.0.

from my knowledge and experience g6 works fine connecting with the new gen consoles depending on the setup though youd need specific cables or adapters is all.

@Jxzo

PS5 via usb on G6

to my knowledge this will not work but worth trying I suppose… the optical ports are the ones designed to go to the consoles while the usb is designed for pc or power supply. regardless youd need a kind of adapter for most of this setup… most of this should work and / or can be tested.

[Jxzo]

I’ve used G6 with USB on PS5 and it works. Also, I’ve had optical in and USB happen at the same time - weirdest mix…

[Grifften]

@Falenkor

in terms of soundstage? no other than AKG and fidelio x2hr… in terms of imaging? yea sennheiser 660s has some damn good imaging to it just that sennheisers suck at soundstage. Sennheisers aren’t bad and I feel they suit more of a jack of all trades approach better than most other headphones… I just find them very uncomfortable due to the natural design… I easily prefer any other brand due to that.

Hmm, comfort is a big deal for me too. I wear headphones almost all the time, both at work and at home. Maybe I’ll wait for the Tygrs and see if I can find a cheap DT990 used for now.

I was thinking of getting a Schiit stack but have also heard good things about the Liquid Spark. I was also debating getting a refurb G6 in addition for portability.

Thanks for the info!

[Falenkor]

@Grifften

Hmm, comfort is a big deal for me too. I wear headphones almost all the time, both at work and at home. Maybe I’ll wait for the Tygrs and see if I can find a cheap DT990 used for now.

the sennheisers typically share a design with one another… I think a good similarity is if your familiar with the hyperx cloud series over there… as they are relatively close in small oval cup design though sennheiser is a bit tighter on the fitting depending on which your going with. For someone with bigger ears like myself it definitely is quite uncomfortable.

Tygrs are a 32 ohm 990 retuned with dialed back treble but still having a more V shaped yet warmer tuning to them… they share in soundstage and imaging to that of the dt 990. The dt 990 is the superior headphone in technicalities and in terms of treble clarity it should be no brainer that the razor sharp sounding 990 is the clear winner between the two of them however the 990 is so intensely sharp it can be a huge miss for a lot of people or it could sound gorgeous depending on the person… to me they sound fantastic its just the mids sound quite lacking. Both of the two work just fine however 990 easily wins on sound quality between that vs the tygr especially in its 600 ohm variation if one can power them. In terms of comfort and build the tygr uses a lighter build and clamp while the 990 is built a bit sturdier however they use essentially the same pads if the 990 comes with its black pads known as edt 990 vb. It is possible to tame the 990s treble through multiple changes but not to the extent of the same signature the tygr possesses… however, the tygr is not as good on the pad swaps as a 990 and it also isn’t as good on equalizing… its very picky about that. No matter how I look at it the tygr is simply put for gamers who don’t really want to invest towards the amp and dac or rather audiophile market yet want an amazing headphone… 32 ohms is easily to drive for most things however, it still cannot be feasibly driven off the ps4 without an amp to help it along… several motherboards though can run them fine and the new gen consoles can run tygrs without issue ampless. This same ampless feature can be found on 560s and 58x jubilee from sennheiser however tygr easily bests them in terms of soundstage and imaging… tygr 300r over there is essentially, to my knowledge currently, the king of the open back gaming based headphones on the market for a competitive gamer with of course the others being mmx300 again beyerdynamic… which is just the gamer variant of a dt 770. Wireless goes to audeze with their penrose

@Grifften

I was thinking of getting a Schiit stack but have also heard good things about the Liquid Spark. I was also debating getting a refurb G6 in addition for portability.

depends on what your looking for… liquid spark is a great amp especially for 990 but it is a warmer amp with rolled treble. If your looking for a clean sound with good clarity I would take a schiit stack or jds stack instead as the spark will add warmth to headphones(bass tones) and roll the treble(which is what helps deal with the peaky brightness on beyers). Good rule of thumb really for most headphones right now is an amp like asgard 3 as that one seems to get along with just about anything I have thrown out it sub $600.

[Javigdlv]

@Falenkor man, i read your last post and then makes me wonder if for a budget option instead of a 560s go for the DT990 (which is not clear to me if its the 250ohms PRO version or the 990s 600 premium or is it another one) because atm i dont find any 660s used cheap enough which its the headphone i like the most.

I really want the best budget headphone with soundstage/imaging/separation to play valorant/tarkov. and i thknk after rechecking the whole thread that you talk wonders about the 990 in that regard.

Im ready to pull the trigger but i need to know what are the technical details of an amp to drive a 600ohms. as i said before i have a little dot1+ its an hybrid amp with 2 tubes and a ss.

Do you know how much power its the minimum required so i can check the manual. i really love this amp and i gave it too much love with lots of tubes for tube rolling, the best opamp , i dont wanna change it.

Also theres the dekoni pads, do you recommend them? but by any means i dont want to have less soundstage or imaging with the change.

[Falenkor]

@Javigdlv

man, i read your last post and then makes me wonder if for a budget option instead of a 560s go for the DT990 (which is not clear to me if its the 250ohms PRO version or the 990s 600 premium or is it another one) because atm i dont find any 660s used cheap enough which its the headphone i like the most.

lol, you will get that… the issue is that while both are good… you won’t truly know if you love that headphone less you try it ya know?

For further clarification and for others that are reading(seriously, I have a ton of people that read this so it needs clarified) the beyers ohms are all different. Anything under 250 ohms for the dt series is considered quite bad, which I can verify as I have sat with them… they take a very large sound quality hit and just sound… well… horrible honestly. The only exception to that was dt 770 at 80 ohms which is just like 250 ohms just a bit less on the treble and was bassier pretty much the only change.

As for the pro vs premium. Pro is designed for studio use and comes with a coiled cable meanwhile premium aka edition comes with a straight cable and is designed for regular consumer or home use. They do have a different aesthetic, clamp, and cable and only the premium version can come in 600 ohms… the 600 ohm variations of the dt beyers are that particular headphone in its top form in other words… theoretically its at its best.

600 ohm beyers need a lot of power however, can be driven just fine off of things like g6, liquid spark, etc essentialy any of the entry levels you will see generally recommended can drive them fine… however, and this is a big note… the 600 ohm beyers have a lot of synergy and scaling to take into account… in other words if used on a higher essentially better setup(more expensive obviously) the sound will change by quite a good amount potentially sounding cleaner, crisp, more slam, more spacious, etc. This has its limitations but its something to take note of that a 600 ohm beyer can grow with ones setup if that person plans to upgrade their amp and dac in the future at some point. Though if you plan to get a T1 like what I use or a 1990… go with the budget option for now and just grab the next step up later… as the T1 over there scales just as much as is essentially just the better headphone over the others in most cases… 1990 is a 250 ohm and while scales well only goes so far…

essentially for beyers the max amp price is around… I want to say $400 before its rather negligible on changing its tonality… this is looking at the monoprice liquid platinum if you love the warmer sound of like the liquid spark, jotunheim 2 if you prefer the asgard 3 can also go with a violectric but thats quite expensive, or the rnhp which is that very clean sound that is known to be exceptional with a 1990 as well as focal headphones.

@Javigdlv

I really want the best budget headphone with soundstage/imaging/separation to play valorant/tarkov. and i thknk after rechecking the whole thread that you talk wonders about the 990 in that regard.

I talk wonders about the 990 because it truly is a special headphone, however it is absolutely without a doubt NOT FOR EVERYONE and I cannot stress that enough. The level of treble from a 990 is quite intensive and can be quite uncomfortable for many people. It also is V shaped so you do not have that mid frequency benefit(the 1990 fixes this btw as does the T1) and you also have a bit too much in the bass(again… the others fix this as well).

@Javigdlv

Im ready to pull the trigger but i need to know what are the technical details of an amp to drive a 600ohms. as i said before i have a little dot1+ its an hybrid amp with 2 tubes and a ss.

I would as said previously reach out to the others on that amp… I have my doubts it will fully drive the 600 ohm variations of the beyers since the little dot was designed more for low impedance.

@Javigdlv

Do you know how much power its the minimum required so i can check the manual. i really love this amp and i gave it too much love with lots of tubes for tube rolling, the best opamp , i dont wanna change it.

Sensitivity by voltage: 97.56 dB/V SPL · Sensitivity by power : 95.43 dB/mW SPL · Average impedance : 612.02 ohm Power handling capacity. . . . . . . . . . 100 mW

those are the specs of one of the 600 ohm beyers. 100 mw per channel @ 600 ohms looks to be what you want roughly as the minimum…

@Javigdlv

atm i dont find any 660s used cheap enough which its the headphone i like the most.

if you prefer the sennheisers I would just wait it out then and put up some wanted ads. or at the very least find a way to try them out yourself

[Javigdlv]

@Falenkor well after checking i think it will be underpowered with the little dot because from what i read it has 300mw @ 120ohms // 150mw @ 300ohms
but it not say for 600ohms but i guess it will be around 60mw to 75mw.
being underpowered lose its ability to stay clear and keep the soundstage and imaging? because i still believe its the best choice.

and thanks again for the help man seriously… much love