So, I was say if you want a brighter headphone thats smoothed out and detailed but not so much in the terms of sibilance especially when you mention it being more relaxed…
I would point straight at the T1.2. Seems to check most of the boxes here my only worry is that it may be a bit too bright for you. You can of course equalize it back but it’s noticeably bright yet smooth and relaxed. Semi open back.
Argons probably have some of the best low end I have heard alongside a wide sound stage… pads can change the argons pretty nicely too so you can increase the treble or mids if you wanted too. Semi open backed has an alternative bassier T60RP variation
If you needed a closed back with brightness… probably point you towards I wanna say 177x GO or perhaps a 1770. 177x go is more refined and tuned more towards neutral bass and treble are raised still but mids aren’t recessed to my hearing sounds larger than the dt 770 and definitely not as sibilant its nice but also will change based on your pad choice. 1770 is the step up from 770s honestly when I tried it… I think I would say it sounds closer to like a W signature as the bass was noticeably raised mids sounded a bit raised as well alongside the treble but in the upper bass/ lower mids and upper mids / lower treble it sounds like theres a bit of a dip. Keep in mind though that beyers are normally not relaxed.
Aeons RT/Open X/ 2: Subtle V if closed back you gain more bass if open back its more neutral with Subtle V signature tones to it. Tuning pads change the sound. relatively wide sounding regardless of open or closed but the open has the big soundstage with quite a bit of depth. Tuning pads can add more low end. Responds incredibly well to hybrid tube amps like Liquid Platinum and will increase the bass further, offer better spacial recreation, better detail, and add a touch more warmth to the mids. The saying for the open back is “feels closed but sounds open” is accurate as it offers quite a bit of isolation behind those around an inch thick sheepskin pads. Great for large ears. Build just screams luxury. Planar slam and speed. Probably one of my all time favorite headphones for I can throw anything at this headphone and make it sound great.
EMU Teak: So, I can’t really speak much on this you’d have to inquire about others on this one. Excellent soundstage that rivals open headphones but with the thick sound of closed headphones, incredibly detailed and smooth highs, natural timber with a balanced tuning from the heavens, great imaging and excellent layering, endgame deep bass control/speed and punch that never intrudes or fails to impress, smooth detailed midrange, non-fatigueing sound for those used to highs, build quality. just copy pasted one of the many reviews… take that guy gushing with a grain of salt if you will please…
Audeze LCD-X another that I haven’t tried but may fit here. may need to look into this one but may also fit this critera well due to the things I have heard involving it. though this one is definitely expensive and potentially at the maximum of your price range.
Still thinking but with so much search criteria thats a tough one
The name of the Clears drive me mad. You almost can’t describe those headphones without using their name and you feel like a shill while doing it. lol. Doesn’t the clears have good sub bass? I only got to spend a short time with them but I vaguely remember them having slightly less bass than I would like but seeming flat way down low. Certainly not the 770 rumble but quick and textured all the way down.
I sat there thinking… alright so what brands really have this kind of sound? lol. Not to many honestly Beyer is very aggressive outside of a select few and they make very bright headphones T1 was a special exception its very relaxed… Audeze make dark headphones outside of a special exception over there and maybe the LCD-1. Sennheisers don’t have that soundstage you may want but are nice just not bright less you consider HD800S but its outside your range. AKG not much experience but not bassy enough. Audio technica again not much experience generally not bassy enough. Philips? Fidelio x2HR is nice but I wouldn’t say it has a whole lot of detail its just a very fun headphone. Shp9500 doesnt alot of bass. Focals are nice yet expensive but they are anything but bassy. The only bassy focal I tried really was the Listen Pro and that was a crazy headphone lol definite W signature. Dan Clark makes the aeons but ethers I wouldn’t really say are all too relaxed honestly never was a big fan and they fall outside of the price anyway. Then you have KOSS which I have zero experience with electrostatic drivers so youd have to ask on that one. Meze are nice but they have a moderate level of soundstage… but very luxury build to them… they are nice but I wouldn’t say they have brightness or a big old surrounding soundstage. Hifiman are generally neutral bright not enough bass quality control issues… they are nice… but I wouldn’t say they are good for movies really
Very nice post thank you so much you have brought some great recommendations. Unfortunately I think most of these are actually not available in Europe .
Shame really as I Instantly liked the Aeons and of course the guy praising the EMU Teak lol .
I heavily consider the T1.2 do you happen to have an opinion on its bass impact and its imaging? Also similarly I am interested in the t5p if you happen to know anything about it. Especially since 177x is for sure not available and I am too scared of the 1770 treble rumors
This seems to be true and honestly I am really considering the T1 or the T5p form beyer.
Currently I am leaning towards this side because if you think about it. I want to take the 770( which is V shaped )and I want better mids with smoother treble while keeping the bass. This sound like either a neutral or a dark or slight v signature doesnt it?
No one said that resolution isn’t there on the Audezes so I am not afraid of them not having nice detail. Just the highs are going to be dark. Hmmm if it can be solved at least a little with EQ (If I dont like it ) its probably the better sacrifice to make for me.
Just need to make sure the soundstage/imaging feel suits me right and if the bass claims are true for something like the LCD 2 C. Or do I need to go for a closed to get nice bass?
Then I am kind of thinking about the focals as well for a more neutral headphone but it is going to be a risk if they are not bassy…
Oh the T5P I actually sat down with that recently out of habit of being a beyer fan boy lmfao. So, I didn’t put it on here cause i felt it was brighter than the 1770 honestly. It’s like… really damn bright. Like you took the DT 990 closed it up and raised the mids a bit more bright.
As for the T1… I don’t think it will be -as- bassy as like the dt 1770 but potentially the 770 yeah. The main issue with the bass is of course… its open back its going to lose some of that impact. It’s still impactful though its very present however so is the rest of the mix. The entire sound just sounds wide like a theater or in terms of movies a cinema. Imaging though? I don’t think I have tried a single beyerdynamic of the higher grade that failed in imaging… practicaly laser accurate like its brother the 1990. Something I figured out from beyers is their flagships are unbelievably good. If I were to compare the T1 to anything at all… hmm. I would say the HD800 from sennheiser would be the best bet just with a bit more recessed upper mids on the T1 more and more bass. I absolutely adore the T1 but I am not sure if someone could fully enjoy it for music due to how bright it is… Its actually brighter than the 1990 its just incredibly smooth and relaxed very sparkly I think the bigger soundstage may help in preventing so much sibilance honestly. Though since you liked the dt 770 so much and you mention the V shape I think the T1 would be fantastic for you if you can maintain the treble.
if by smoother you mean just less treble then yeah particularly but I wouldn’t go so far as to say dark as that is quite something different entirely. You could go with a warmer sounding headphone which generally have more neutral mids and treble audeze have a few like this and may fit in this case. In terms of the slight V I would immediately point to Aeons as I have not tried better but I don’t think you can get them which is unfortunate I swore dan clark shipped them worldwide.
Depends on which audeze. some of them are pretty dark while others can be more towards neutral. worth a shot if you wanna look into them. That’s a bit out of my area though youd have to ask around to those who own a lot of those headphones.
In most cases if you want a lot of nice bass you would venture towards closed back yeah. LCD-2 though is definitely dark for sure.
They aren’t bad per say but if you really enjoyed that thumping rumble and bass quantity from the 770s I would recommend you search another brand… the only one I listened to that had more bass was the listen pro.
Wow so this post was very very helpful overall. I will read deeper into it and try to take it all in tomorrow as its kind of late. But I want to quickly ask a couple of things.
Was that the first or second gen? Because they claim that they have tamed the treble and made it “silky” lol with the second gen. FIngers crossed its true but I guess not.
So you say the T1 is quite bright but smooth but is it also sibilant? And this is what I have been wondering. Which cheap"ish" headphone would you recommend to try just to check out a similar sound in terms of the brightness just to “prepare” to see if I will like it?
Also something cheap"ish" again to try on darker side would be cool as well as to maybe understand better what the Audezes will sound like?
Again it just seems that a darker sound even if not that preferable (since we can’t find perfect) might be easier to tolerate on the daily rather then an overly bright sound which can in fact be tiring.
The T1s seem pretty amazing honestly and I tend to get a bit fanboyish on beyer as well since the DT770 is my first love but I can’t help but admit that there seems to be a small issue with the highs lol
hmm, if thats silky then I question it… lmao. So, its not as bright as the first gen. I had the 2nd gen and tried the first gen a ways back during a store visit. 2nd gen isn’t as bright and seems like they dialed back on the treble in the lower and upper frequencies however they also appear to have recessed the mids in the process. It’s alright but it feels like more of an upgrade to the DT 990 just in closed back form. It’s incredibly bright I would recommend it for music but not so much like movies and the like. Hope that helps on that one. It’s good just not for an all case sort of use.
I had zero sibilance issues on mine but I also had it paired to a Liquid Spark / Asgard 3 / Balanced to a liquid platinum. All of which are good for dealing with bright headphones. It’s a 600 ohm headphone it needs quite the powered up amplifier and one that can be useful at tolerating that treble. If you for example tried using a THX 789 amp that has a nasty habit of making headphones sound anemic or brighter you will most likely regret that choice to say the least lol. Then again, please keep in mind I have next to no issues with treble. T1 is bright but I don’t think it’s overwhelming its quite comfortable and teeters right on that edge of just being too much if that makes sense.
A headphone to check to see if you can manage brightness? hmm. Honestly, due to how the mids are on the T1 I actually am drawing a bit of a blank there. T1 is quite special in that regard. But if its just brightness… I wanna say grab a pair of the DT 990 in their 600 ohm version. While the mids won’t be there it has the bass and similar treble. However 990 is very aggressive and much more peaky so don’t take that as an absolute example of how the T1 is. I completely love my T1 over my 990 due to the differences. The only other I can think of cheaper would be… Technically you are already using a big similar headphone over there with the 770s. If you want a comparison. Open the headphone up take some impact out, bring the mids in the mix a lot more but keep the roll off in the upper mids, add a massive wide soundstage, laser imaging, relax the sound, take some sub bass extension out, remove a touch of clarity out of the mids due to the soundstage, smooth the hell out of the highs… actually just smooth out the signature as dt 770 is a bit irratic in its response think a arc from low bass to the upper mids than a dip than a relatively steady rise up in the treble than a smooth roll off. My terminologies suck and thats the best I can do lmao
If you can find one… Nighthawk Carbons or Nightowl Carbons. Or hell just go grab a Audeze Mobius and throw it on their house sound those are cheap and will give you a general idea(it has that gamer-y kind of sound so don’t expect a ton of quality but it still gives you a general idea)
Depends on your personal preference. So to me it took me weeks to get adapted to dark signatures. It sounded muffled veiled like I threw a big ol cover over my sound. Absolutely dreadful, I thought my lord how can anybody listen to this??? Then after a while I adapted to it… now I love it to death… It’s very acceptable much more than bright headphones. I love Dark headphones of course but I think Warm headphones, those with the mids neutral as well as highs, are better for just regular use honestly. If you want a good example of a warm sounding headphone go grab the Fidelio X2 HR while you won’t get immense details and resolution and all that its a great example of what a Warm headphone can sound like with a wide soundstage for a super cheap price Takstar pro 82 would work too if you up the bass on its slider.
I was like that when I first bought my first beyer headphone… At first I was like wtf is this? For transparency I was a bit ballsy and went straight to the dt 990 250 ohm without an amp that helps with that treble. First taste of sibilance day 1. Though after a bit I found my flow with it… I found the 600 ohm much more enjoyable ended up venturing to the 1990 and T1 and found them much better than any of the previous DT series.
So super helpful thank you so much. A few more questions might be coming your way tomorrow lol but very honestly your last few posts are awesome just what I needed!!
Which ones have you tried? Aeons are moving up my list the more I read about them, and the price isn’t bad for the flow RT, however not sure how that compares to the 2s.
Also curious if there’s a reason that you aren’t recommending the 1990 as opposed to the t1? Is the t1 smoother up top?
Also feel like I’m a beyer fan boy after buying 770s. haha
All but the new 2’s which irritates me beyond belief I will tell you that. No store around here carries them and I can’t afford an audition right now. Though Seriously, I recommend you never buy the original aeons and flows… RT is similar to the open X but the open X has a bit more neutral tuning while RT has more bass(this also coming from my message from dan clark about the similarities as well). 2’s are said to be more refined and opened though I can’t say for sure if they are worthwhile I personally use the Aeon Open X with considerations of switching to the RT.
It isn’t as peaky, smoothed out, and it doesn’t have that large drop off in the lower treble you will see looking at the dt 1990s sound. I like the 1990 but its very aggressive. For a more relaxed wide approach I will say the T1 before I say 1990
Don’t let ‘dark’ scare you off from Audeze. Dark doesn’t mean lack of clarity or detail. Bass is great as well. I have LCD-2 Fazors and LCD-1, and have tried LCD-4s. They don’t all sound the same, though there is definitely a ‘house’ sound.
I get my 1990s monday so we’ll see how I like them. My one worry is that they will be too aggressive for daily use, and I will be doing a bunch of reading on the aeons in the meantime. I am looking at the RT open, although everyone seems to prefer the closed version. The 2’s are still a bit pricey for me to consider, unless I sell a bunch of stuff including the 1990s
Hmm, so the RT are still relatively a new addition. The original flow opens were very undesired so most of what you read is probably involving those. Bass compression and a lack of dynamics were a common complaint on the originals. If you want more bass you will be fine with the closed but if you want that open backed go for it. I don’t think you will be disappointed… I appreciate my open x a hell of a lot. Granted the mids could be a little more into the mix, its a subtle V after all, I still find it very relaxing and comfortable. As far as I am aware RT is only obtainable through dan clark directly and Open X is over on massdrop. RT though can come with its balanced cable without seperate purchase which is really nice
That was my issue with them actually. I wanted to lay back and listen but the 1990s are so aggressive I found that not as feasible as I did with the T1. Granted the T1 are actually brighter, technically if you look at a frequency, though I think the wider soundstage with angled drivers makes them much more comfortable. It’s the only headphone with that much brightness I can feasibly lay back and listen to without issues. Paired to my liquid platinum it dials in the treble more while waking up the lows and mids and it just sounds so much more open. The T1, Aeons, Nighthawk Carbons/LCD-2, and Tygrs are some of my daily drivers just depending on what I am doing or want to listen to at the time.
Hmm one last question, and I feel bad hijacking this thread, but have you tried a sendy aiva or variation of them?
I wonder how those compare to aeons since I do currently own the m570. I feel like they will be fairly close in comparison.
Tried the aiva in particular due to a few recommended them to me… Not quite sure why they are so hyped up honestly. Bass light, neutral mids, raised treble. I can go buy the sundaras they sound better to me in the same sound signature. I will give the build quality and comfort 100% to the aiva though that caught me off guard. So soft and comfortable on that one all nicely packaged in the “Butt case” lol. Aiva’s sound nothing like the aeons.
Sat there thinking had to pick back up my aeons for a bit there… Lets see more bass, more extension, sounds fuller, mids are relatively neutral still but the warmth of the lows adds a touch more on the clarity, not as bright as the aiva treble is raised but just a small amount over the neutrality just enough to add a little bit of sparkle and detail and bring out some more characteristics in the sound. Build quality oof there both nice there… depends on if you like the wooden cups of the aiva. Aeon just screams luxury everything about it from the feel to when you put it on. Aeons are a hefty boy when you put them on they just feel big alongside that big sound they have with inch thick sheepskin pads. I am positive aivas are lighter with thinner pads I found aivas to be more accepting with their angled pads and lighter weight. Aeons out of the box had some pressure on my jaw line due to the size of the cups if you put them on a foam block or some box or something for a few day to stretch them out this no longer becomes an issue. Aeons do however generate more heat than an aiva @tourangh
Alright so I have some news @Falenkor . Today I have been playing around with APO/PEACE EQ… silly me didn’t think of trying this before to check things.
So something revealing happened. I boosted the bass just a little (with the pre-amplfying turned down a little).
I turned the treble from around 3,5k and upwards all the way down to -20 or-15 or -10 db (depending on the song, metal needed some more highs or when I watched some guy just talking on youtube).
Lol I quite like this sound, bass is now great and the sound is much smoother. Especially when listening loud no harshness at all. Detail is still there as well I think although I haven’t done extensive testing.
The mids are lacking though and I could have made it worse.
Funny thing is I can still pick up slight sibilance on some people. I tried turning the gain back to stock and I just realized I don’t like the highs at all on this, very harsh even muddy at times. I must have gotten used to them.
So now first of all I think I would like to get a Loki because I found playing with EQ very fun. I am just putting this here because I think I saw you mentioning somewhere that you wanted to get one?
I am wondering if you can generally EQ bright headphones down and ease the “treble murder” a lot of people find. At a quick glance there doesn’t seem to be much of a negative with this…
Also I think I can probably hear Audezes calling to me after this… Do you agree?
@tourangh Have you played around with EQ? Maybe you will like it as well…
Give it some more time, you might find your final eq settings to be different from what you like immediately. Some of it could be liking something new and different but then part of that high wears off
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