HIFI system for a Mid-HIFI guy

In Europe, Pro-ject can make a lot of sense, as it’s typically less expensive than here in the US. They not only make great turntables and phono stages, but their other gear is nice too. I really like my Phono Box DS2 USB. Their integrated Maia looks pretty cool for an all in one solution. You could also look at Denon for an integrated like the PMA600NE. Teac also makes some quality stuff that should be available in Europe. For headphones, the Clears should be a solid choice, though I haven’t heard them to confirm. They may not give you much more stage than the Senns, though, as they’re fairly intimate.

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Please can you help me a bit with different turntables from Pro-Ject then? Which line/model is a solid choice?

Alright I’ll add Phono Box DS2 USB to my phono pick list :slight_smile:

I’ve read that Clears are like that 'cuse of the smaller 40mm drivers.

Since you are in Europe I would consider using local to your continent products. Project, Kennerton, focal, sennheiser, just to name a few. Easier to deal with issues if they arise and hopefully a dealer within a few hundred Kilometers of where you live would allow for auditions of some pieces. Good luck

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I don’t have any direct experience with Pro-ject tables, as I run an old Realistic Lab400. My research has mostly been in the entry level, so the Debut Carbon hit the list, and can be incrementally upgraded with things like acrylic platter and better cartridges. Rega Planar is another line to consider if available in your area. You can also get a lot of value if you can find used vintage stuff like Technics, Dual, Thorens, etc.

@German_Power has been very helpful with turntable advice, and is in Europe, so perhaps can help here.

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Here in Europe, the Planar 3 is my top choice.
A solid platform with a lot of potential. There are many upgrades that can be made over time.
Add a 2M bronze or gold ring 1042 and you can be happy without any problems.
Phono preamps are the more difficult topic. You have to spend a disproportionate amount of money to have something solid in the long run.
Pro-Ject Phono Box DS2, Lehmann Audio Black Cube, Trigon Vanguard II

I’m not that much of a headphone expert. But as an European maybe consider a Soekris dac1321 / dac1221 and Lake People G111 combination.
An SPL Phonitor could offer you several inputs and with the analog crossfeed possibly the desired spatiality?
But others should help you with the headphone stuff… and listening to it yourself is still the best, sorry.
Planars are definitely a good choice for high quality bass, but not necessarily for a lot of bass. LCD-2 Classic, LCD-X are all good, i like both, in the end it’s a matter of taste.
For your budget, I would advise you to invest in a good front end. exaggerated: I would rather hear a 200 € Beyer headphone on a 2000 € front end than the other way around. Headphones are even more a matter of taste and you will likely just have to experiment a bit.

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I updated the list of things that are “decided” (bold items)

1. Turntable - Rega Planar 3 black
2. Cartridge - Goldring 1042
3. Phono preamp - Pro-Ject Phono Box DS2
4. Headphone amp - Liquid platinum, Topping A90, Lake People G111, Schiit stuff
5. Headphone dac - Topping D90, Soekris dac1321, Schiit stuff
6. Headphones - Focal Clear, HIFIMAN Arya, Meze Empyreans, LCD-X, LCD-2, HD800s
7. Cables (optional if needed)
8. Some sort of switch (if needed so I can go from turntable to dac easily)

Does someone know if there is a device/headphone amp that has two inputs - one for the DAC and one for the turntable? Also, something that could switch the output from the turntable to headphones / speakers?

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Some of the Schiit stuff has an optional phono module, like the Asgard and Jot2, but with the Pro-Ject, you’d just need a second RCA input or you could run the optical out of the Pro-ject into your DAC instead. That’s what I have mostly done. With things like the V200 or G111, or Jot 2, you could run XLR inputs from a balanced DAC and RCA from the Phono Box. Lots of options.

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I’m sorry that there is so little going on here at the moment …

2 and 3:
If you have a high-quality preamplifier or integrated, it often makes sense to look for a cartridge that goes well with the built-in phono preamp. That’s how I did it with my Luxman, because the integrated phono preamp actually has a lot of potential but cannot be adjusted.

Phono pre-stages such as the Trigon Vanguard II or the Pro-Ject, on the other hand, can be adapted to the desired cartridge. Tonal preferences can also be adjusted to a certain extent.

I would advise against digitizing the analog phone signal.
XLR cables are optional for short distances.

Great Idea! The G111 has a switch on the back
About the V200, sadly not: " When a cinch plug is inserted, it cuts possible signals applied to the balanced input automatically. I.e. the cinch input has priority."

7, cables … in my experience, cheap audiophile cables are usually a letdown. Either Amazon Basic or € 200 per RCA, everything in between is no good.

8th.
Unfortunately, Y-cables are not a good idea either.

How should the speakers be integrated and which components do you already have?
Personally, I’ve been using a HiFI preamplifier between the DAC / turntable / SACD … and the headphone amplifier for years (volume knob bypassed). This investment is of course more sensible if you also connect speakers to it. A good integrated with recording output can also be used for this.
Unfortunately, I don’t know of any high-quality, simple A / B switches …
Possibly look for something like a Mackie Big Knob Passive or other imput switcher in the recording area.
HiFi devices like: Pro-Ject Pre Box S2 Analogue, Violectric PRE V630 … are unfortunately outrageously expensive.

I really don’t feel competent enough to make recommendations about the following…
The best option is probably a headphone amplifier with multiple inputs (SPL Phonitor, IFI AUDIO ZEN CAN SIGNATURE 6XX, EXPOSURE XM HP) or a DAC with bypass for an analog signal.
There are preamps with good DACs (Pre Box RS Digital) or phono preamps so you could look further in this direction.

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Sorry guys, been very busy over the week, lot of work. I made a sketch of what the “current” + planned setup would look like. Let me know your thought below.

Turntable and cartridge are solved, this week I’ve seen that Focal released the new Clear Magnesium headphones. From what I’ve heard about the original Clear, this seems like a small upgrade to the same sound formula so for now, this is my top pick.

The headphone amp needs to have 2 inputs for the DAC and phono stage. Also, the phono pre amp needs to have 2 outputs for speakers / headphones.

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You have a lot of duplicate paths in there.

For sake of simplicity, I also “redded” the digital part of the system out :wink:

This setup assumes your DAC will run single ended (= RCA) output. You need a 2-to-1 switch and 1 Y-splitter.

Not really, the thing you removed was the phono preamp for the turntable.

Then move the phono-pre before the switch I drew in?

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It burns my eyes.

Why is that, component choice or?

Just teasing about the aesthetic of the spaghetti graphic. It overwhelmed me.

It’s not as simple as sound quality in review though. I had a Clear, LCD-X, Arya and Ananda in front of me at a dealer for about 5 hours. I intended to upgrade from my Ananda, but the Arya sounded too similar with more treble, the LCD-X was too heavy but sounded great, the Clears just made me wish I was listening to my speakers and didn’t really provide me with the bass I got with planars or anything really new or exciting compared to what I had which is really subjective.

If you can, which I understand can be hard at the moment, I would audition before buying. Personal sound preference is heavily going to dictate if you like them or not.

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Well that’s exactly why I started this thread in the first place, to hear opinions about the “worth” factor.

I’d also like to try it out before buying. In Croatia these are the only high end headphones I can try: HD800s and LCD-X. Traveling to Austria/Germany just to try out headphones is a far stretch especially now. That is why I’m looking for help in the first place.

The Phonitor 2 seems great, but it is really expensive, is there an alternative with 2 inputs at the back?

I understand the difficulty, but I really can’t recommend blind buying a headphone at this price point. Good luck though!

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So hypothetically, what would be a good place in Austria that is not too far away from Croatia for instance where I can check out all the usual suspect headphones such as HD800s, Arya, Clear, LCD-X, HEDDphone, Emperyans and others in that price category?

I’ve searched HiFi shops in Austria and haven’t really found a shop where there are many headphones to try, let alone to buy. (not even sure that you can try those that are available) Especially things like the Emperyans, Focal stuff, HEDDphone … I’m not sure I’ll be able to try them all out before making a decision. Right now in Croatia, I have HD800s and LCD-X available to buy and maybe try.

I’m not Joshua Velour or some other Youtuber that tried 30 different headphones and 100 different amp/DAC pairings that I can confidently say oh I like this and that, and these are the things I don’t like.

That is why I’m asking for personal opinions of people who maybe own or have heard some of these headphones.