Agree, definitly an adjective used to describe their end result…amazing how many words out there have similar meanings…
See we all are learning things!!
https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/s-m-s-l-sp200-thx-888-amp.24028/reviews#item-review-23410
Take a look, interesting perspectives…on this THX AAA Achromatic stuff…
I changed the title of the thread and the first post.
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Bumping for a discussion of the THX amps.
All depends on what you want your system to sound like. Producers and mixers love THX, its clean, its transparent and its perfect to produce on. People like me who want a warm sound or something to relax down to don’t like THX as it’s too clinical, same problem I face with the RNHP. I just don’t enjoy music on THX equipment as much as tubes.
All depends on your use case.
I’ve personally never been to a studio where a thx headphone amp is used. I have been to a few studios using thx , but not using THX AAA, instead are either THX certified or using THX surround stuff, not really the same thing. I see way more studios with neve gear than thx for sure lol (if you are going to compare to the rnhp)
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I would like to see who uses the THX for mixing. I haven’t heard of anyone using the THX for that yet. Personally, I don’t think is enjoyable at all unless using the balanced out. The numbers of the single ended out on the amp don’t compete with cheaper amps of the the same sound. But… for VERY easy to drive IEM’s (kz zs10 pro) I do really enjoy the amp for those. I will say, the sound on the Audeze LCD X on balanced sounds more acceptable than it does being driven single ended (this recent discussion + getting my new balanced cable had me swap out the RNHP for a bit).
I will say, I have a bit of buyers remorse for the THX 887 because 1) I blew one up already, completely killed the amp and am on a replacement (Monoprices’ customer service was stellar with great turn around time) 2) because it sounds so much line the Schiit Magni Heresy, I regret buying 2 things that sound the same essentially. 3) I bought this amp with all the hype surrounding it and honestly it under delivered on the hype. For the price, sound, and unless you’re going to exclusively use this amp balanced then MAYBE I can suggest it.
What this amp really taught me is that what I enjoy, experienced, and see from Zeos and Josh Valour is that I have different ears then they are. This amp taught me that the entire chain of gear matters. I ended up spending $1200 replacing equipment to match $1200 headphones… because of this AMP and the reviews I heard. So some very entertaining reviewers (that I still watch and respect their opinion) plus reviews praising how low the THD on these amps are… failed me and I have the receipts to prove it. When people go asking about this amp people need to look at this equipment for what it does and not buying into the rather seductive hype on the amp.
To explain the hype a bit, lets look at HOW the hype happened. Zeos and Josh Valour used to have a Johtunheim, For $400 it’s better than the Johtunheim? I would say yes but can’t say I’ve done an A/B. More importantly Zeos and Josh were looking for amp there were better for reviewing and they needed something better than what they had without being more expensive than what their target audience could handle. Combined the ASR recommendation, the hype has been over blown. So before people just assume get the amp (seriously, that’s what I did) I can’t stress enough to check out one’s gear first. Also remember, some of our favorite reviewers are not gods, they’re people learning with a camera in their face and need to create content.
Sure, this THX 887 for me is meant to listen to anything Star Wars related to me personally because growing up with that THX certified sound… it does it for me but that’s personal bias exclusively. With my EE background, what I’ve read up, what I have experienced my amp recommendations are like this for the budget.
Analytical first amp (amp only reference):
- Schiit Heresy/Schit Hel/Schiit Fulla 3 (M0N claims there is a difference between the Fulla 3 and Heresy, my owning both says differently)
- JDS Labs Atom
- Mayflower O2/Arc series
I’m missing the reference here specifically that sited how similar they sound and upon more lost resources… all use the same op amps. All have their origins with something like CMoy amp that any EE student with an altoid tin either thought about or DID build. You missed the days of headed battles of op amp rolling… Regardless, the THX amps are based off of using a big single chip with multiple op amps designed like the amps just listed. If you’re looking for single ended only THX like sound, there you go and fix damn near anywhere.
Oh… and never heard of op amp designs. Here: https://www.bursonaudio.com/about-us/discrete-circuits/
More “musical” warmer sounds first amps:
- Schiit Magni 3+
- Schiit Asgard 3
- Geshelli Labs Archel 2.5 (<- still op amp but going off of research only)
The Schiit’s are a more classical approach but done MUCH better than the bog standard book approach of class A/B amplifiers from people that worked in audio before starting a company. Geshelli labs have a nice output and something that is still very clean op amp like (from resarch only, I may buy one because curiosity). The Geshelli labs op amps are different from the first listed amps. You can find them here from TI’s website.
Conclusion, is the THX AAA amps measuring up to the hype? Not exactly, however with the right DAC and headphone they CAN be good. This hobby is in pursuit of sound. If want hear music how the creators intended their music then get stuff like the RNHP or Sony products (some studios are cheap and will buy Sony studio products because of the name and price alone). If anyone does use the AAA amps to mix music, I’m all ears for listening to it if you can tell me what song.
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I would prefer thx over the jot, but the jot really wasn’t great in my experiences, so it would be an upgrade in my eyes but neither are great for the price imo.
Yeah that’s also something to consider, THX is pretty well known and was respected (until they were in the consumer market bought out by razer and they started slapping thx certs on everything lol, still somewhat respected in the pro scene), so it would have some brand recognition. That being said, thx tech and thx certification are very different things
A note on that phrase: you will rarely hear what the creators intend their music to truly sound like (and almost never hear what people in the studio hear), but you can get close enough if you are into that by not screwing with it too much. But really it’s a pointless effort and you should get something that suits your tastes and move on
Some good neutral, accurate, commonly found studio oriented brands (not going to name specific models) that come to mind for a headphone amp (not including interfaces or consoles that have good headphone outs): Rupert Neve, Lake People/Vio/Niimbus, Little Labs, Grace Design, Concert Fidelity, SPL (Phonitor), Palmer (their higher end stuff), and more. There are many that just use their fancy interfaces or adc/dac as their headphone amp and also their console and that sounds great. You can (and many do) use hifi oriented products for studio use as well, so more options open up right there.
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Completely agreed. However, when you find a song or artist you like and see the match in equipment there is a bit of a warm aha moment that happens. You don’t go looking for it but you do appreciate it when it happens… and I’m convinced having 1 pair of Sony’s around are good JUST for that reason (even the MDR-7506’s are just good enough for my own personal checkbox there).
Have tried using the SUCA-AUDIO Tube-T1 Preamplifier with THX amp?
Joshua Valour seems to like it.
I mention it because it might add the “warm or favoring” you want.
Ah yeah matching headphones to a certain artists is a reasonable thing to do, just saying people are after a fruitless effort of getting the same sound in the studio unless they want to recreate the entire signal chain and the entire setup including the room for the exact track they listened to
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After learning Winter Garten uses the RNHP, I get it. I agree, entire signal chain is a fruitless effort. Especially because it could be mixed or mastered by someone else with completely different gear.
That does help a tad, but the flaws of the thx are still prominent even with a tube buffer. It does help take the edge off the thx over sharpening but it’s still prominent, and it does make it a bit less analytical. It does affect the staging and imaging a bit, but that part really isn’t fixed and the thx still doesn’t preform when it comes to spatial recreation and separation. I think you would easily be better off spending 600 on a monolith liquid spark or a schiit lyr 3 and getting that same type of sound but better imo. Also when you add in a tube buffer, aren’t you defeating the point of thx being best measurements? When you add in a tube buffer you would affect your measurements in a negative way, which imo is the whole point of buying thx (as personally I think if someone were to spend a few days with both thx and another competing amp they would pick the other amp going off of actual sound only)
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Yes, in the big budget realm sending it out to a mastering house is not uncommon, but that being said many more midrange or budget productions just combine mastering into the mixing process (which can still sound good if done right)
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I have not, I’m more in the market for an OTL or hybrid tube until MUCH later in the ear. I’ll be figuring that out after I get my ZMF Ziricote Eikon’s in (probably 5-7 weeks out).
Back to the AAA amps… The THX 887 and I assume the 789 have similar gain outputs and volume knobs. I do REALLY like the THX amps for IEMs from crap tastic to whatever else I got. Because of that advantage, having something like the SMSLS SMSP 200 where it has lower volume issues REALLY bothers me and I know I personally could not own that piece of gear.
For anyone else wondering, given the fact I purchased a Blon B20, Airist R-2R, NDH20, Kph30, and THX 887… I’m convinced 1 key difference from my ears and Zeos’s ears is that he enjoys listening at a much louder volume than myself. That’s a lot of money spent in the last few months to learn that lesson.
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Agreed. That harshness is still there.
Yes. But it is nice to have 2 different sounds available at the flip of a switch.
But yeah, for the price these tube buffers go for I think it makes more sense to pair them with an Atom. Less harshness and still good solid state and tube sounds at touch of a button.
Harshness? On a THX amp? I’m on my second one amd harsh is the last word I would use with these amps.
I think that’s in comparison to other amps and certain headphones. Not that thx is outright harsh.
I’m curious, I want to see if I can recreate this harsh sound. Either I’m learning something about my hearing/preference.