Long as i get to look over the shoulder for the answer.
By any means necessary.
Ummm… Measurements don’t matter. 
Outside of baseline reference, they really don’t. None of those measurements is going to tell me how a piece of gear is actually going to sound, let alone whether or not I am actually going to like how it sounds. So there is that.
I just think you have to do your research, be mindful of your spend limitations and make the best choices you can. But ultimately you have to jump in and try things. It will be a little while, but the next step for me is either going to be the Bifrost 2 or the Denafrips Aries II. And honestly, in this day and age of stupid government energy policy I don’t think I am down with keeping a R2R DAC powered on 24/7 and wasting energy like that. So it’s looking like the Bifrost 2. I want to experience the Multi-bit technology and hear for myself what it brings to the table. And of course, going back to the synergy aspect, I will have to think hard about which amp to pair it with. It seems like you can’t do one without the other.
Oh, and I was wrong about the 10-12 week wait for the Bifrost 2. Website says 6-8 weeks. Maybe by the time I am ready to purchase it will be even less.
3 Likes
I think Guttenberg’s point that “you don’t buy audio equipment to measure it” is the killer argument here. Just because something measures better or is more “transparent” or whatever doesn’t at all tell you whether you’re going to like listening to it better, and whether you like listening to it is the only thing that matters.
2 Likes
I can’t be the only one that thinks Amir from ASR sleeps with 94db sine waves playing all night. There’s no way that guy listens to music.
5 Likes
I believe you.
What does everyone think about MQA ?
Awesome ill pose the question there too if it would will help. Do measurements matter?
In the case of MQA, actually measurements matter, as it is actually shown to be a lossy format and adds some distortion in higher frequency I think, and is nothing like the original master. (which without measurements are harder to prove)
But whether MQA sounds better to anyone that’s subjective and measurements won’t matter
its all hip hop and R&B to me. I need measurement to dial in the DSP for hometheater. So im here to stay informed.
One could look at this way. Measurement only matters if youre comparing it to other gear listened too.
1 Like
Fair point about home theater, but at the same time, with room treatment and proper placement, DSP or other room correction can sometimes become a non-factor. In some setups the treatment and placement may actually improve the sound compared to DSP. DSP is much more convenient, though, and may be the only option when treatment and placement aren’t possible or practical.
All for it whatever will improve my setup.
Cable riser mood stones im all about it.
1 Like
Isn’t it all just another way to justify a purchase when looking for a DAC? If its an improvement to your ears and you like what it does, and has all the measurements you care to favor, does anything else matter? If the next person doesn’t like it, must mean they like something else. I think of it as different flavors or something. In the end of it all, we should enjoy what we do because ignorance can be bliss and chasing the dragon can be a very big problem or something you really enjoy.
I heard a big enough difference from the topping e30 to the ifi micro bl to justify upgrading to a higher end DAC. I want what these dacs can do for my ears. The improvements and differences to me are very worth it and I was able to pick out differences while listening with my headphones and those differences turned out to be things I liked. The question is, have you caught that dragon yet or is it worth it to you to keep on chasing? What ever you chase, enjoy, if not, the cycle continues and that’s okay. right?.. right? Maybe this just never ends, lol
2 Likes
For the record, my feeling on MQA is that it is bullshit and I will not have anything to do with it. I don’t even want that shit as a feature on any of my gear.
1 Like
I h[quote=“Raptor168, post:37, topic:26625, full:true”]
For the record, my feeling on MQA is that it is bullshit and I will not have anything to do with it. I don’t even want that shit as a feature on any of my gear.
[/quote]
I have ave the latest MQA firmware loaded onto my Ifi Micro Black Label and Nano BL dacs and I dont use it now that I cancelled my Tidal subscription. I plan on reverting back to the older firmware that doesn’t change the filter to suit MQA…Don’t want it in the system even if it’s only software…
1 Like
I agree. I looked at the SMSL M400 but it’s all in on MQA, so I said no. Seems like most of the new Chinese mid-high end stuff offers MQA now; and all of them are more expensive than ever. This is all MQA gets us. This is partly what makes the Aries II and the Bifrost 2 attractive to me as an ultimate replacement for the non-MQA SMSL products I have today.
1 Like
I’m not a hater of any technology although I want to have the final choice.
I’m done with Tidal so therefore have no need for MQA… My ifi dacs were fine before I added the MQA firmware update. That was my choice then, now I’ve changed my mind and would like to undo the process.
1 Like
I wouldn’t say I hate MQA. I do have a strong dislike for it! 
It just seems like a bunch of marketing hokum. It solves a problem that doesn’t exist and only seems to make the record companies richer. It doesn’t seem to benefit the artists and it sure as hell doesn’t benefit the consumer. So it would be OK with me if it died a horrible death and simply went away. But I guess we are past that point now.
Ultimately I agree with you, I just want to have a choice. Obviously I don’t want to deal with MQA, but for those that like MQA, have at it. Freedom of choice and all that.
1 Like
I wasn’t able to notice a real difference in DACS until my headphones got to the Focal Clear/Arya level. With TOTL headphones it’s even clearer -no pun intended- to my ears.
Others can probably hear more with more entry level headphones. My tin ears needed great cans and about three years of critical listening and gear comparisons, lol.
3 Likes
Is that a form of measurement?
Technology Connections made a fantastic video explaining the mathematics behind DACs:
Signal to Noise greater 90dB is more than good enough (Vinyl is 50-ish dB, typical CDs are in the 90s dB range).
I don’t think I ever saw measurements of DACs that are actually useful (outside of Spec Sheets from the DAC chip manufacturers that have loads of graphs instead of single numbers…)
Some things you could measure (by no means complete):
There is a minimum BOM cost to reach a given quality. It is not just the DAC chip, but the supporting components for power supply, filters, etc. The cost can only go so low before cutting corners.
Same for size. A properly designed circuit board can also only get so small (or large) before compromising isolation, signal integrity, etc.
You would be surprised what tiny differences humans can detect reliably.
Everything the signal touches or passes through matters. The extent to which it is important to you, is up to you.
Feature Count ≠ Quality
4 Likes