Sundaras, m1060c, 1770x go, mmx300, Focal eligia


So I’ve gotten a pair of Sundara recently. Upgrading from a pad swapped pxc550.

I drive them off a fiio m6 mostly on Bluetooth.

I listen to a fair amount of music on the go.
As my first pair of open backs, I assumed they would be fine outdoors.

I’ve walked around with it for about 2 days.

I don’t mind the occasional sound coming in.

Most people on an open space outdoor can’t pickup the leak as much as I feel it indoors on enclosed space. Atleast not anymore than an average leaky closed back.

Now what I’ve noticed on 90% volume. On the bus and walking around the crisp on trebles and punch of bass is still there but as soon as I get back indoors it just feels more armospheric. I have no complaints with the passing car. I can’t hear relatively distances conv. The humming on the bus is ok as well if I crank up the volume a bit. * And make sure to sit a bit far*

I’m just trying to figure out if I’m compromising too much on the detail when outdoors? A good speaker would still get outside noise for example.
But the detail would be there.

Am I just trying to find an excuse here ahahh? Or are sundaras or even any open back is a complete waste outdoors?

I’m going to try set one of my fav acoustic vocal track all day indoors and test run it outdoors. The missing should be pretty obvious to me then I believe.

The sundaras does lack the soundstage and bass punch though. Outdoors

I’ve been pushed towards sending the sundaras back. Cause of my outdoor listening

Idk what comes closer to the sundaras as a closed back if I want the crispy detail with relatively wide sound stage, instrumental separation, quality tonality. Not over powering but warm fun present bass, impactful vocals and the satisfyingly detailed crispy and perfectly comfortable highs of the Sundara.

T60rp argons are too much of effort and hastle. could m6 even power a t60 properly?

Are the highs on m1060c really bad? Are the mids not nice? It’s pretty known for its lows and sub it seems.

Zeos says mmx300 sounds better than argon m3s :ok_woman::joy:! I’m quite lenient towards them to he honest ahahh! But it’s v shaped? I wonder if the mids are too recessed.

Tbh 1770x go, a perforated chunky pad is said to solve the harshness on the highs. might be a long wait and bit of another hastle to get in from the US still.

Where does Focal eligia stand in all of this? Is it really worth the extra money. Don’t think I can comfortably afford it just of yet!

What is the closest that comes in and under 300£- max stretch £600 price bracket would you guys say!

Sundaras would 100% be keeper if I had the money to afford a second pair for travel and commute. But then where does my pair of audio pro c3 speakers fit in? I guess I don’t get the super super intimate crispiness on highs but it’s still there. I’m finding it hard to compare open backs to speakers and why for the other tbh.

Thank you!

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Welcome to HFGF!

Whilst I don’t know the exact specs, sounds like a) you might need a closed back instead for noise isolation so you don’t have to turn the volume all the way up and b) Sundara may not draw enough power from a DAP. Both 177x and Elegia are well regarded, only problem is they aren’t worth it anymore for the price in the UK. If you want to keep it under £300 for easy to drive closed backs, I’d suggest looking at something like the Denon D5200. You’re right though the T60 is likely to be less efficient than the Sundara.


Don’t bother with the T50-T60’s for mobile use they’re too power hungry.

I’d recommend the Elegia is worth it the mid forward sound will be more familiar with the Sundara’s. Great bass extension too with slam. They’re worth the extra money.

If you can’t afford them the Denon D5200 or any of that Denon line are an easy recommendation they v shaped but really nice and the build is good too. Very easy to power. These two would be my recommendation


also since you’re outdoors a far more cheap pick would be an IEM a Tin T2 or a starfield would be a cheap and simple recommendation that would be akin to that Sundara sound.

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I don’t have too much outdoors experience with my Sundara but I don’t believe in open backs in public. But that’s just my opinion of course.

However this is pretty baffeling to me… The Sundara’s have a pretty amazing soundstage for the price and while being far from bassy, the bass they do produce is pretty punchy and ‘planar-y’. But am I correct that you told me you drive these off the Fiio M6?

Maybe just not quite the type of soundstage they are looking for?

Possibly they are wanting more rumble???

I’ve seen it before, BELIEVE :stuck_out_tongue:

They want a heck of a lot of power. Which is why I asked if you’re driving it off the M6.

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Speaking as someone who tried EVERYTHING to get them reined in, even felt in various shapes over the driver, it’s a nope but I’m sensitive up there, so maybe the perf pads will work for you.

I meant when out doors lol. And yes off a fiio m6 for now. Been eyeing a hip DAC tho. But probably no time soon.

Yeah… See according to Fiio the M6 outputs 72mW at 32Ω.
If you feed it anything less than about a watt I honestly don’t think they perform at all.

Fairs thanks for the input :))

Why are you so keen on using headphones for outdoors? I tried that a while back with Bose qc35…

  • if the temperature outside is more than 22 degrees it gets hot. Not to mention if there’s 36 degrees like now. :sweat:
  • if it rains I can’t simply pull over a hoodie from my sweater or jacket because it often doesn’t fit over the headstrap. And if it does it leaves half my head uncovered. And walking through the rain with >300€ headphones is not something I would want to do. :sweat_smile:
  • If it’s cold in winter I like to wear a beanie or something. Same problem with hoodies.

So for me headphones are just not that convenient outdoors. Im using AirPod Pros if I don’t care too much (and the transparency mode is just extremely handy if you need to talk with someone once in a while, e.g shopping).

And if I do care and want to listen to proper music I use IEMs driven from a FiiO bt5 or through the FiiO utws 3.

Would that be an option to you?

Iems feels like to me they are specifically designed to fall off your ears lol.

Do they really come close to over ears? Isn’t it like a proper camera and a phone situation?

They will only fall off if you want them to. :slight_smile:
Like if you shake your head violently enough you can also make your headphones fall off. Actually I think it is even easier to let your headphones fall off than IEMs that fit properly in your ears.

IMO soundwise there are very few things that headphones could do that IEMs can’t. Actually the only thing that comes to my mind would be soundstage and the openness feeling. Which you would kinda sacrifice anyway with a closed back headphone.
I don’t own any headphones / IEMs that are like >500$/€. My limit is around 300 - 400. And from what I can tell is that in or below this range soundwise IEMs offer a better value for money than headphones. It comes down to fit and comfort for me.

You should give them a try. Get the blon bl03 for example. They cost around 30 €/$ and are pretty amazing for their price. Try if you get a good fit with the stock tips. If you like them there are a lot of options to upgrade from there …

They certainly can, though generally speaking in the budget range not so much from my experience. Given the right source and synergy, though, a TOTL IEM can hold its own against a lot of high end headphones. For example, my Infinity Mk2 running on my P6 Pro convinced me to sell off most of my headphones and desktop gear, including things up to the level of Diana V2 running off of a XI Broadway.

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Hi all, updates.

I’ve gotten a hip dac for my sundaras.

One of you were right about sundaras being underpowered on fiio m6 :slight_smile: !

They’re a lot more crisp now.

I’ve been taking these out and about.

They are Okey. On public surprisingly xd!

But I would rather not have constant anxiety over it being too loud.

I’ve gotten a pair of moondrop starfields!

They’re almost as clear as the sundaras! Obviously not so spacey. But imaging and crispiness is outstanding.

I trialed a set of Bayer mmx300. They’re way too toned down on the mid range. Sent them out for return!

Tbh. Iems surprisingly sound better than closed backs,

Thanks to one of you I’ve actually given iems a go. Since growing up the in ear types of earphones that you could get for cheap always slid out of my ears.

But iems on small tips worked out amazing! With a little bit of opening my jaws and pulling my ears up and twisty insert they get a nice deep insert and it sound gorgeous!

Thank you all!


But open backs still retain the details outdoors as far as I have taken it out with me on buses and walks and streets! But you just need to turn it down a wee bit when on quieter streets xd!

Moondrop starfields come damn close to sundaras, imaging and clarity! just not the stage.They open up a bit with Dolby Atmos.

You bet ya. Sundara really really love power.

IEM’s can really get close to headphones for often a third, a quarter or less of the price. My big issue is always they never get spacious enough :stuck_out_tongue:

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