The Feliks Echo Mk2 is a highly recommended tube amp around here, although I havenāt personally heard it myself.
I can tell you that the 6XX on a tube (DarkVoice) amp with good tubes is a truly enjoyable listening experience for me, and if I had started with that to begin with, I probably wouldnāt have gone down this audio rabbit hole. It is exceptional for listening to rock and metal.
And yes it sounds different than a good solid state amp, especially depending on the tubes you roll.
Had these in for a while. Leather headbands from Turbulent labs. Pricy but a godsend for everyday wear!
I tried the Dekoni Elite Velour with my DT880 Pro Black 250 Ohm (modded, i use the edition headband instead of the pro headband and the stock grey pads instead of the black pads) and im quite dissapointed. They add a lot of soundstage, but it sounds super unnatural for me, vocals are way too distant and feel kinda echoing. The tuning also changes quite a bit, it makes it way too dark for my liking.
I dont know if its only because of the shape of my head, but I also noticed, that the Elite Velours are super sensitive to compression/clamping force. They sound very different, depending on if i use it with the pro or edition headband or if i bend the headband to a wider shape.
I also tried the DT1990 analytical pads with my DT880s and they actually sound quite good. They dont add as much bass as the standard black pads which come with the DT880 Black Edition, they just boost it enough to make it an overall warmer sound, it stills sounds very balanced to my ear. So if somebody here has the DT1990 and the DT880 at home, i would definitely suggest to try the analytic pads on your 880s.
What do you think about Zen Can for the 250 ohm (and 600ohm). Are they enough? Iām using the Zen Dac atm for the 250 and the headphones are heavily pushing the Zen Dac with power matching on. Maybe I need some more juice? Why Iām asking about Zen Can is because its easier to find around 100 bucks used in EU, where as the Atom and liquids goes for 160 bucks, and I would have to buy dacs and pay more for it.
Would be an upgrade indeed.
Zen DAC 13mW at 300 Ohm (Single ended)
Zen CAN 161mW at 300 Ohm (Single ended)
If you could rewire your headphone to be balanced then you would get 645mW at 300 Ohm out of the Zen CAN. If you can use it only single ended then something like a SP200 (326mW) or L50 (636mW) would make more sense (Same power XLR and SE). Used condition they are a little higher in price than 100ā¬ though.
For the Zen CAN you also need a DAC. For all 3 Amps you could use the Zen DAC as, well, a DAC. So you also could keep the truebass function.
Ok, so still, unbalanced cable Zen can + zen dac wouldnāt be enough for the 600ohm? But zen can and unbalanced 250ohm headphones will be enough?
For the 250 Ohm version you would be fine, yes. 600 ones I donāt think so. Heard them on a iFi iDSD micro black label (around 300mW) with volume near max, wasnāt impressed. If that is your goal save up for the L50.
Edit: iFi has a power calculator which says 600 Ohm would be still okay-ish but it also says the same about the 250 version on the Zen DAC soā¦
If you should decide to get the CAN maybe you can order some open box 600 Ohm and just give it a shot.
I always point to my experience on Magni 3 when I could actually max the volume pot in comfort. Iād be seeking north of 200mW at 600 ohm
Just as another point of reference, I use the Schiit Asgard 3 with my 880ās.
300mw and vol pot set at 2 to 3 Oāclock. I wouldnāt want any less for them.
PS love it!
My 2 cents hereā¦
Beyerdynamic recommends an amp that can output 100mW at 600 ohm with a 100 ohm output impedance. For whatever reason, they think thatās the best match for their cans. Thatās what their headphone amps are rated for. I donāt necessarily agree. You donāt need that high of output impedance, but the 100mW is probably a good guide. The challenge most budget amps will face is that they may deliver 100 mW into 600 ohms at 1KHz, but they donāt have the power delivery ability to deliver 100mW at 100 Hz and 10000Hz, among others, all at the same time.
Youāre in an unfortunate position. The hi-impedance (hi-Z) Senns and Beyers are easy to obtain worldwide but sufficient budget amps for them are not. In the EU, your reasonably priced options are limited. I found the Zen CAN to struggle with bass control for hi-Z headphones, and that was from the balanced output. I have taken heat for that but I stick by it. As iFiās amp calculator claims they will get plenty loud, but the higher the impedance gets, the more noticeable the lack of control in the bass becomes. See my above comment about power delivery. The Zen CAN has a 5v-2.4A power input, which just doesnāt cut it over the entire frequency range. Your other easily-obtainable amp options in that price range are likely Topping amps - and justā¦no (IMO). Those have their own problems in power delivery. I found the L30 and A50s to make Beyer headphones go sharp as hell in the trebleā¦way moreso than other amps in the price range, and that only scratches the surface of their issues.
My best advice is pinch your pennies and save until you can land a Lake People G103s at a price youāre comfortable with. Thatās a German company and should be relatively easy to get ahold of in the EU. It will also have plenty of power to handle the hi-Z cans, even with the Zen bass boost engaged.
Good luck! Please let us know how it goes.
I am able to buy Atom Dac & Amp for ~300USD (including everything), here in EU. It may be 90USD more than what you pay for it but itās still a viable option for the 600ohm right? The Atom lines are probably the most easily accessible/budget friendly, of all the options Iāve found. The other setup, maybe Iāll pair my Zen Dac and buy a used Zen Can for 100USD, and get the 250ohm DT 880. Iāve seen videos and people claiming that itās not big of a difference (and Iāve also heard the opposite lol).
Lake People G103-S goes for 277USD on Thomann and the āPā version goes for 330USD. Thatās too much for me to spend, just that I could have the Beyer DT 880 600ohm. Iāve only tested the 250ohm lightly but as of now, paired with Zen Dac, the 900 Pro X is the better package. No need of a dac/amp and still very good. But what the DT 880 have over it and all the other headphones Iāve tested is that insane imaging and detailing in the games I play, but is that difference worth 200-300USD more? Maybe Iāll just opt for a TYGR 300-R instead, Iāve heard alot of good things about them aswell, and I wont need to spunk out 300 dollars on an amp and a dac.
Edit: I just found one guy in my country that sells his barely used DT 880 for 80USD. If I could spare that 100 on new ones, it would be good hehe.
My 880 & 990 600 Ohm cans needed my Singxer high gain/full tilt to drive them. That was loud and Iām a loud listener but it was when I got a Cayin IHA-6, high gain/11 oāclock, that was when I heard those Beyer drivers being properly controlled. The Singxer SA-1, a lovely sounding, powerful amp, wasnāt doing them justice.
The atom+ has 136mW at 600 / 250mW at 300.
For that money you get the L50 (290mW at 600) and are entering A30pro territory (250 euro open box on amazon.de, 440mW at 600) which would work in Class A on headphone above 250 Ohm.
Impedance Power
16Ī© 750mW
50Ī© 1130mW
200Ī© 940mW
300Ī© 850mW
600Ī© 530mW
Those numbers are suspicious high, but I canāt find any measurements.
For the g109 they claim
18.8 Veff in 600 ohms = 590 mW
13.8 Veff in 100 ohms = 1900 mW
10.7 Veff in 50 ohms = 2300 mW
7.8 Veff in 50 ohms = 1900 mW
3.7 Veff in 16 ohms = 410 mW
(from drop.Com)
Here I can find ASR measurements that say 350mA at 300 and 1.1W at 32 Ohm. Quite a difference.
Those lake people / vioelectric are studio amps. Problem is that many studio sources (DAC) output more than 2V / 4V and then you can reach those numbers. To have this power at home we need to buy something like a RME adi 2 dac that outputs like 7Vā¦Or am I missing something?
Iāve had DT880 in 250 and 600 ohm and I didnāt like the 600 ohm on the Atom and at the time concluded that upgrading my amp for that particular edge case wasnāt worth it.
Iāve played a lot of FPS with the 880 and TYGR and the only way you can go wrong is if you prefer one sound signature over the other and end up with the wrong one for the music you listen to regularly.
Yeah, L50 is available for 235USD, so would need a dac aswell. But like I said, spending 300 bucks on dacs and amps is harsh for me due to using my headphones other than gameplaying. I could occasionally listen to orchestral music and watch sports talking in Discord with headphones on, but thatās it. I use a soundbar because frankly, I think that the DT 880 (standard), are pretty uncomfortable.
Anyway, I found two guys in my country that sells the Modi 2 and Magni 2 and one have the 3, both selling for 150 USD. Itās a reasonable price, hope theyāre availableā¦
But you already have the Zen DAC, right? That could be your DAC.
Hm, I probably need to read on the differences then. Iāve heard good things about the TYGR 300. But I would need to drive down to Germany or get one there to send me one because Beyer doesnāt sell them in my country lol
When you say the DT880 are uncomfortable, were you testing with a premium/edition model or the Pro model? beyerdynamicās pro headband has a noticeably higher clamping force.
I would question those ASR numbers, honestly.
