🔷 iFi ZEN CAN Headphone Amplifier

[Haze]

The crosstalk on my unit measures at -59db. I contacted ifi support and they said this is normal and intentional.Here is how it looks.

[sebastien_chiu_iFi]

Ah yes, this is intentional! Thanks for checking in with us.

[Serge_X]

Yes it has a lot of crosstalk. I’ve just checked with my HD600 and crosstalk is very audible when you play only one channel you hear it in other one. In ballanced it’s less loud then in s.e.Then I tryed my Asgard 2(class A) and it has pretty audible crosstalk also, but less then Zen Can.
Then I checked Liquid Spark, and this one has almost no crosstalk even on very high volume just a litlle bit.
Also I tryed Asus DLX amp and no crosstalk too.
Just for curiosity I checked Zen Dac built-in amp and it’s too has very litlle crosstalk, but i don’t like the quality of this built-in amp, Zen Can sounds better.
I would like IFI to explain why they made this amount of crosstalk in Zen Can. The point of balanced amp is to have more separation? In real life I dont notice it.

[Haze]

How does the Liquid Spark comparer to the Zen Can? I’ve heard they are similar.

[MazeFrame]

Crosstalk is always unwanted.
Crossfeed is intentional and wanted.

[Blackrao]

my bad got it confused haha

[Serge_X]

I doubt that i can distinguish Liquid Spark, Asgard 2 or Zen Can in blind test on HD600. But I have Monolith M570(Sendy Aiva clone) these headphone love Zen Can. I don’t know why but M570 sounds really better on Zen Can even then Asgard 2. For Me Zen Can sound a bit brighter then Liquid Spark or A2.
by the way crosstalk was discussed on audiosciencereview a lot and someone whrote 'Crosstalk measurements are interesting, no question, but as a sidenote, in headphones no crosstalk will amplify the dreaded “playing in the head” effect." I don’t know is it true or not.

[Serge_X]

Crossfeed

[sebastien_chiu_iFi]

Thanks for linking this Serge!

[DragonFish]

Hi all - I have a question.

Just got a Zen stack recently but 4.4mm cables are expensive for me.

Can I use a 3.5mm to 4.4mm balanced adapter on the zen can so I can take advantage of the balanced headphone output of the CAN?

Like the one on the photo.

Thank you.

[WaveTheory]

Hi! Welcome to HFGF!

Unfortunately, no. There’s no good way to use an unbalanced (aka single-ended) cable on a balanced output. An unbalanced cable doesn’t have enough conductors and will end up shorting out the output.

You can safely adapt a balanced headphone cable to a single-ended output, but not the other way around. If you’re US-based, Hart Audio Cables is an economical solution for cabling needs.

[Blackscreen]

The adapter in your photo is for using a 4.4mm balanced headphone in a single ended 3.5mm jack. I’m reading the text of your post as wanting to use a 3.5mm headphone in the 4.4mm balanced port. If you have a 3.5mm headphone use the 3.5mm port on your amp. The only common adapting of the 4.4mm balanced port should be to 4 pin XLR.

What headphones are you wanting to use n the 4.4mm output?

[DragonFish]

Thanks for the welcome!

I see. Very good info to know. Thank you so much!

[DragonFish]

Sorry - I posted a different photo.

It’s supposed to be 4.4mm male into a 3.5mm female.

So I think the explanation of WaveTheory covered it.

Thank you as well for taking time to read and answer my question.

[sebastien_chiu_iFi]

Just confirming what folks have said here - unfortunately, there is no proper way to do this!

Happy to answer any more questions if you have them.

[Chripo]

Hi all,

@WaveTheory Thank you so much for the review, I really enjoyed reading it a lot!

I’m currently looking for a reasonable priced DAC and Amp for my DT 1990 Pros and am currently favoring an Ifi Zen DACv2/Can stack. Since balanced outputs generally seem to deliver more power, I have already ordered all the stuff needed to mod my 1990s for a balanced input via 4.4mm Pentaconn on an amp.

In the review the DT 1990s were mentioned in the “unfortunate” section because the Zen Can introduces distortion on 250-ohm DT headphones in the low end and especially when using the XBass.

My questions:

1. Regarding the 1990s, would that distortion likely be noticeably less when using the Zen CAN’s balanced output?
2. Alternative: Since Schiit products (Modius, Magnius, Asgard 3) are not readily available in Europe, would a Topping A50s (15V power supply, 4.4mm balanced out) combined with the D50s DAC be a better choice than the Zen stack for the DT 1990s?

Thanks, Chripo

[WaveTheory]

Hi! Welcome to HFGF!

@Chripo

DT 1990 Pros

Nice can!

@Chripo

I have already ordered all the stuff needed to mod my 1990s for a balanced input via 4.4mm Pentaconn

If you’re comfortable doing it, modding a Beyer DT is often handy. I would recommend that you mod it dual-entry detachable, or at least balanced detachable, so that you can use it on a SE output as well.

@Chripo

Regarding the 1990s, would that distortion likely be noticeably less when using the Zen CAN’s balanced output?

Yes. The CAN might be borderline OK for this headphone. I can’t say for sure though.

@Chripo

Alternative: Since Schiit products (Modius, Magnius, Asgard 3) are not readily available in Europe, would a Topping A50s (15V power supply, 4.4mm balanced out) combined with the D50s DAC be a better choice than the Zen stack for the DT 1990s?

Schiit needs to get their schiit together in international distro, for sure! I was not a fan of the A50s by any stretch. What price can you get a Lake People G103s for? That’s our standard entry-point amp rec for our EU friends.

[Chripo]

@WaveTheory

If you’re comfortable doing it, modding a Beyer DT is often handy. I would recommend that you mod it dual-entry detachable, or at least balanced detachable, so that you can use it on a SE output as well.

I will try this mod which replaces the original 3-pin mini XLR connector with a 4 pin mini XLR. Additionally, I plan to make a corresponding cable with 4.4mm Pentaconn plug together with a separate 3.5mm TRS plug to 4.4mm Pentaconn jack adapter for SE outputs. Hope to get along with these for a while.

@WaveTheory

I was not a fan of the A50s by any stretch.

Thanks for your review and opinion on the A50s. From reading stuff on the web, I had the impression that it would be a good choice in the price range of about 200EUR/USD, especially when using balanced out (SE seems to be less capable though).

@WaveTheory

I was not a fan of the A50s by any stretch. What price can you get a Lake People G103s for? That’s our standard entry-point amp rec for our EU friends.

On Amazon, the G103-S is 269 EUR, A50s 199 EUR and the Zen CAN 169 EUR (without iPower, which would add another 50 EUR).

My thoughts on these three are as follows:

• G103-S: most likely the best sound on a Dt 1990, highest price of the three amps, no balanced in- or outputs, no stackable DAC (could e.g. use it with a Topping E30), not very attractive case, maybe not very portable due to the large power connector used.
• D50s/A50s stack: should deliver enough power on the balanced output for DT 1990, no balanced input, very nice looking small sized stack, should easily be portable in a backpack.
• Zen DAC/CAN stack: most likely lacking power for DT 1990 even when using the balanced output, lowest price when not considering the additional costs for iPower power supply, balanced in- and outputs (but balanced in does not noticably improve sound quality), nice medium sized stack, should also be portable in a backpack.

Would that be a reasonable summary for the three options? And how would a Schiit Modius/Magnius stack compare to these? If that stack would offer the least compromises, I would consider ordering it directly in the US.

Any feedback is greatly appreciated!

–Chripo

[WaveTheory]

@Chripo

G103-S: most likely the best sound on a Dt 1990, highest price of the three amps, no balanced in- or outputs, no stackable DAC (could e.g. use it with a Topping E30), not very attractive case, maybe not very portable due to the large power connector used.

I wouldn’t worry about balanced at this price point. Here’s why:

Is Balanced Better? Pros & Cons of Balanced vs. Single-Ended

To Balance or Not to Balance? That is the question. Whether ‘tis nobler to buy a balanced amp or DAC or an unbalanced (or single-ended, aka SE, the two terms are interchangeable) amp or DAC is the focus of this post. There have been lots of questions around this forum about whether a balanced amp or DAC is better than a SE amp or DAC. Should you explore balanced? Is balanced better? It’s understandably confusing. After all, in the English language, ‘balance’ is often used in the context of desc…

It’s still potentially forward-thinking to balance mod your DT1990 if you can do it safely, because it will open up the possibility of a wider range of amps to use down the road. Balanced amping does not inherently sound better, though.

The G103-s is probably the best sounding amp you have on that list. I haven’t heard it myself, but I trust those who say it’s the real deal at the price point. You don’t have to match it with a Topping E30, though. You can use a Zen Dac V1 or V2 with it just fine.

@Chripo

D50s/A50s stack: should deliver enough power on the balanced output for DT 1990, no balanced input, very nice looking small sized stack, should easily be portable in a backpack.

You will get sound.

@Chripo

Zen DAC/CAN stack: most likely lacking power for DT 1990 even when using the balanced output, lowest price when not considering the additional costs for iPower power supply, balanced in- and outputs (but balanced in does not noticably improve sound quality),

I like the Zen DAC just fine as a DAC. I’m not nearly as high on iFi’s entry-level amps.

@Chripo

should also be portable in a backpack

This is a wrinkle I didn’t expect. Do you need transportability in your setup?

@Chripo

And how would a Schiit Modius/Magnius

If you’re gonna order Schiit gear, I would strongly suggest the Asgard 3 amp. IMO it’s the best <$200 headphone amp on the market right now. With shipping and customs, it might be close to the price of a G103s (?). My recommendation for you, if it’s isn’t too much money, would be to use a Zen DAC as a DAC and connect it to either a G103s or an Asgard 3.

Good luck!

[sebastien_chiu_iFi]

Thanks a ton for helping @chripo with the great info here