Luxury Precision P6/P6 Pro R2R DAP

Im more so looking to build a chain to try out several cans so I can figure out what I do want to focus on. A chain to try new flavors if you will. I do realize that is not an efficient way to do stuff btw. I just have a massive physical space problem

EDIT: Also, this may just be because of my lack of experience with sources, I know flavor of chains synergy quite drasticaly, but I had kind of assumed you could classify resolution and layering ability kind of broadly into tiers (hence why I asked what tier p6p would fall into). If thats a bad assumption please let me know

I mean you can try that, but it doesn’t mean it will have synergy with everything, ideally you want multiple amps. Hmmm for something you could pair for the p6p and drive a wide range of things without leaning one way too far, that’s going to be hard if I don’t ignore the susvara, so I will just ignore the susvara and also keep things under 5k used. I think a mass kobo 394 ii is fairly neutral and drives most headphones pretty well, out of what you mentioned it powers the vc, diana v2 and 1266 pretty well, and the clear, but the arya will imo get a bit too bright on there for my tastes, and it doesn’t have enough for the susvara. A niimbus us4+ (now us5 pro iirc) is a good pick for something a bit more analytical leaning, for those headphones as well). A modwright ha300 will drive all those cans fairly well and lean a bit more neutral warmer than neutral but still pretty great with them, can drive the susvara but again not to the extent I would personally want. The formula s + powerman does drive things pretty well but you won’t be getting the most out of your p6p since it has to run single ended (but it’s still worthwhile), also a bit more neutral warmer leaning. Any of these would be substantial upgrades over using the internal amp of the p6p

It’s really hard to actually answer this question since I really would want to know what the definitive focuses would be instead of just testing things, and also I would want to bump the budget more to around 7k+ if you wanted to go for the 1266/susvara to really take advantage as that puts you in the range of things like a wa33 (actually a good all rounder for the cans you have), egoista 845 (more focused toward the 1266 and susvara), bakoon amp-13r (more focused toward the 1266 and susvara), trafomatic primavera (more susvara and 1266), riviera aic 10 (actually well rounded), etc, and you can continue to get into speaker amps for those two headphones. In my mind with what you’ve listed, the 1266 and susvara would be something I would really focus on and ignore synergy with some of the other headphones, as those two are the most needy and things like the vc and diana v2 are more forgiving when it comes to amp pairing so that would be where I would make your compromises

I mean compared to other portables? Compared to a desktop line out as dac? Driving headphones or iems?

I mean as a dac, I’ve already kinda pitted it against something like the holo spring 2, so dacs similar to it’s performance I guess would be it’s tier, it’s not going to compete with a lot of the dacs I like around 5-3k used with things like a lampizator amber 3, aqua la voce s3, berkeley alpha series 2, some of the audio note/sq1x dacs around that range, the sonnet morpheus or higher end metrum dacs, the rockna wavelight, bricasti m3 or m1, msb analog dac, merason dac-1, xi sagra dac, lessloss echos end and the list can go on. It fits well into the 2k range of dacs with things like the yggy a2, dangrous music convert 2 or burl b2 bomber, mytek brooklyn with psu pgrade, benchmark dac3, bryston bda-2, wyred4sound dac2 variants, etc with most of these it trading solid or some blows, or fairly outperforming overall things like the soekris dacs, the denafrips pontus and ares ii, holo cyan, mhdt dacs, older benchmark dacs (honestly possibly current one as well), auralic vega, etc. I’m really just spewing out names here which isn’t going to be really helpful, as it would be much more helpful to just compare one on one as that would give you a greater sense of how it actually competes

It’s just hard to give you a meaningful answer without some sort of focus and direction

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Don’t wanna derail the thread, but curious which of the Amber 3 range have the best single ended performance (whether on par with balanced or being dedicated like the Amber) with good synergy with the Formula S. Currently mostly have my eye on the Amber, but not dead set, and other than LCD-24 and Diana V2, the only upgrades I could see in the future would likely be Sus or 1266.

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It all depends on what you want to do with the xi audio, what aspects you want to prioritize

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Naturality tends to be top priority in both spacial recreation and timbre, with a slight fun/warmth tilt.

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In that case the amber 3 does make a whole lotta sense (more fun leaning with great warmth and body, expansive stage, great control and technicalities while still being a bit forgiving, pretty impactful), a rockna wavelight could also be a good choice (a bit more sharp and holographic in placement, nice detail retrieval, slight warmer softer tilt, pretty good timbre), and also something from sw1x like a dac ii special or dac iii (a bit more neutral warmer smoother leaning, somewhat relaxed but very organic and technically proficient, good body and heft) but that’s a bit more warm relaxed than warmer fun. If you could find an msb analog dac that would be real nice (it’s somewhat neutral but a sweeter tuning with very good body and density, while being a bit more forward with it’s technicalities, staging a bit less wide but really good depth). A denafrips terminator could also be a consideration but I don’t know if I would call it as natural as other aforementioned options, but it is warmer fun leaning for sure (it’s got decently good technicalities overall and it’s signature is fun, but I can’t say it sounds that organic imo).

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Some news on the case front.

  1. L&P does not sell the P6 Pro case separately. This means I can not just buy one to take apart to make my pattern to copy the case
  2. Musicteck does actually stock the P6 case (no top) so I have ordered that to pull apart for the patter.
  3. On closer inspection, the case actually has a stiff back insert. TBH, im not realy sure why they did that, but its at least not something hard to mimic (and should be a natural result of doing the back of the case sandwiched the way they did if I just glue the entire slab)

basicaly once the musicteck case gets here, ill seam rip it and get a proper pattern made t try and get a mock up done

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@M0N is the WA8 justifiable at the new or used price in 2021? When it came out it was hot shit, but I’ve barely heard any cases of people still using them

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If you didn’t see it, he did a massive run down of several portable amps. Seemed to like the phantasy 2 better overall for a portable tube so long as you dont plan to use iems on it

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Thanks, I saw the WA8 mentioned much earlier in the thread and didn’t keep digging. I had read the rundown, but must have missed the bit about the W8 and the phantasy 2. If you miss a couple days, this thread can get away from you. I’m trying to avoid reading too closely to avoid the temptation

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I mean used you can typically find wa8 around 1.2k and I think that’s pretty justifiable, new it’s a bit tougher pill to swallow but it’s still feasible I guess. You are getting a quality product though

Pretty much, although it also depends on what type of sound signature you are after, the woo is a bit more smooth and relaxed neutral leaning where the phatlab is a bit more noticably warmer fun imo, but the phatlab does have improved technicalities

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Thank you. It was such cool tech at the time it was announced, all the reviews were positive, then I stopped hearing about it almost entirely. The novelty of portable tubes isn’t quite so unique any more, so it fell off of my radar pretty fast but it’s something I had added and removed from my shopping cart many times in the past

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It’s probably because it’s a real stretch to call it portable, as it’s not really something to be used on the go, but moreso taken along in a bag to be used from desk to desk on a trip or for work. That’s probably what kinda reduced the hype for it after it came out

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An update on me thinking the P6P is way too loud at min volume. I got a dB meter yesterday and with ear cups sealed my desired listening volume on Focal Clear is 45-50 dB. So it would seem it is just a me problem, not a P6P problem :+1:

That is low. Though, I’ve found that laying down at night, I wouldn’t mind a little more play in the volume control. Low gain on the Rai Penta, I use the minimum volume and would turn it down a touch if I could. Normal listening I might get up to around 10. Was surprised when I plugged in the PortaPros yesterday and had to turn it up to over 30 on low gain. And yes, PortaPros sound great on it…about to pull out the KSC75s today since I haven’t tried that combo yet.

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KSC75 are surprisingly good on it lol, but the ksc75 scale really well already, they have no business being able to scale that high

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Yah. I had to get an IEMatch for mest, and even with it I will listen at like 5 or so on low gain out of 4.4

Ive heard MH775 are the same. Should be getting a set in soon from a friend in the UK as well.

So… TIL the P6P comes with a screen protector… I didn’t realize the bottom of the case lifts out for accessories so ima have to check when I get home to see if mine has that in there. Also, apparently there is a bag for ot? May start using that when its not in use. I was so excited to get into using this thing I didn’t even know it had accessories…

haha…yep, and there’s a quick start guide in there with (a little) helpful info

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Ok. Just a couple updates on the P6P since I want to talk about it.

General thoughts

  1. I am now convinced I can reliably hear BT vs internal storage. That said, I dont know if it is the resampling of android that I am hearing or the actual BT transmission its self, but there is a notably blacker background on local files and a dash of a sharper feeling to notes (maybe because of the backer background). This is particularly noticeable when using LO to an amp (and mind you, when I say “particularly” I mean it took me a month of 4+ hours a day to pin down…)
  2. I admittedly dont understand synergy too well, but there are some serious synergy issues with the P6P 4.4 → focal clears. They feel closed in, congested, and maybe even dark? That last one isnt used in the typical FR meaning, but the sound just reminds me of being “dark”. This is completely remedied by using my Mass Kobo 428 in LO mode though, and in fact, with this combo, I am starting to think I may actually enjoy it more than my hugo 2 (my previous top spot) for clears.

P6P → Mass Kobo 428 Vs Hugo 2

Obviously having a much cleaner and faster amp stage with the P6P/428 combo there are some gains there, but far more so than that it is the increase of the stage dynamisms (P6P/428 combo is much better at the intermediate distances away from you as opposed to just kind of “close and far” with the H2) with the trade off of some image clarity and total stage. I personally prefer this trade off over the H2 as it makes my music feel much more dynamic (onto this later). While the Hugo 2 is, what I feel to be, a polite listen with no offense and good capabilities, the P6P/428 combo is much more willing to get aggressive and agro as needed (a trait of each that holds across several cans). The last trait is kind of a combo of the previous two. Micro detail in the H2 (especially ones hidden in high dynamic range) gets brought up and kind of played on the table in front of you. With the P6P/428 (and even just P6P by its self on IEMs) those details get their own portion of the stage sometimes being easier to miss and sometimes being right in your face. IMO, these traits are very much so appreciated for when I want to focus on the music and have to hold my attention (think I may prefer the H2 for office style listening though) making me feel like I’m listening to music with the P6P while with the H2 I feel like I’m listening to music as presented by chord

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