TH-X00/TR-X00/E-MU Teak/Denon biodynamic general discussion

ShaneD · December 12, 2020, 10:51pm

Just to clarify, do you love them? Did you love them when you bought them, or not until after the Lawton mods?

I liked them when I bought them and more after I did the driver mod. But, I do not Love them. I got a good price on them, but then did the driver mod and bought a Periapt balanced cable. I am into them for $700.00Cdn. The Lawton cups and pads would cost me a bare minimum of $600.00Cdn. landed and possibly much more depending on the cups.

If I was to make these the most expensive headphones I have ever owned, I would have to LOVE them or at least Love them.

Of course the only other option is buy a different set of closed backs for even more money and sell this set- up at a loss.

I just want a closed back that I LOVE.

ShaneD · December 12, 2020, 10:53pm

My dream model would be a W-shaped sound. What would that take?

Deleeh · December 12, 2020, 11:07pm

So if you want to go in the direction of W Shape then that means harder wood.
So already in the direction of Ebony.

Have you ever heard them?
Emu sells them for 140$ but in standard version.

I recently rebuilt them with Yaxi pads and Dekoni rings and am happy with them.

But the death bass for me still has da rosewood from Emu.
It still goes through the skin.

Unfortunately I don’t have a Lawton mod yet to compare which cups are better at the end of the day.

Delta9K · December 12, 2020, 11:08pm

The primary reason I’m looking new is that I want detachable cables so that I can have options for SE and BAL use.

I totally get that once you have a set, that you can then swap chambers and pads to augment the sound characteristics. That is a major plus to me. I’ve even thought that if I were to buy one or the other (Teak or 610), that initially all I would need to do is just buy the level 1 mod, or just the tune up for the new pair, and put the chambers I have now on the new set.

ShaneD · December 12, 2020, 11:12pm

I do want strong bass, but I am not a bass-head.
I jumped on the W-shaped comment because I really do LOVE my Focal Elex’s.

But I would hate to go all in, to the tune of $1,400.00, $1,500.00 or even $1,600.00 in Canadian bucks and not be really thrilled. And resale on modded headphones will be shitty.

WaveTheory · December 12, 2020, 11:14pm

It’s not bonkers hard to make those detachable on your own. I had to do that to my set. The post is above but here’s the direct link:

Although maybe do that after you get a second set…just in case

WaveTheory · December 12, 2020, 11:15pm

Right, I don’t think doing a Lawton mod is a good project for a beginner. I think it takes some time to know your preferences before you commit to one. Once you know what kind of sound you’re after and can explain that to Mark Lawton, he does an excellent job of helping you select the chamber(s) that will work best for you.

Deleeh · December 12, 2020, 11:18pm

@ShaneD

Yes I see.
That is the only criticism of the headphones that the connection is just crap.
I would have preferred a 3.5 mm plug connection.
The findest only on the Emu Teak and must order separately that you want to have that.and costs extra.

Otherwise, there is nothing to criticize the Emu from the base.

Yes, unfortunately, you need every time you have a new earpiece the level 1 kit from Lawton.da leads no way around it.

On Alliexpress you can usually find the Fostex plugs.Are a bit shit to solder and have to do it right.
Because plus and minus are interchanged or mirrors are reversed.Somewhere I have a photo still where that is shown.
So that the plug at the end does not fall auseinader I still have a shrink tube made over it.

Red circle:
There again make a heat shrink tubing over the plug then it also stays together.

ShaneD · December 12, 2020, 11:18pm

Yes, I have already had several conversations with him over the months. I know what I want, but sound is different to everybody

A_COC0NUT · December 13, 2020, 12:10am

If you DON’T want B A S S then stay away from the type 4 woods. Type 5 is fairly similar to type 4 but with less bass (to my understanding). Mark told me that type 3 was a fair bit warmer than the stock purple heart cups, so… I don’t know. Mark knows what he’s doing and will more than likely give you exactly what you ask for.

Another thing would be to pad swap if you can. Chances are you will find a pad that sound closer to what you want then you can go from there.

ValentineLuke · December 13, 2020, 3:30am

They’re my favorite headphone.

I’ve owned LCD-X, Focal Clear Professional, AKG- Q701 (?), Grado SR-60, and Koss Porta Pros.

I’ve listened to Dan Clark A2C, Focal Utopia, ZMF Aeolus, HEDD HEDDphone, and Hifiman Susvara all in my home for extended listening. Of all the headphones listed the Lawton modded Fostex are my favorite. The only headphone that I enjoyed as much as these was the Susvara (it’s astonishingly good).

ShaneD · December 13, 2020, 5:27pm

One last question for my 610’s:
Has anybody here ever gone from stock pads to Lawton pads and stopped there?
I don’t want to spend $89.00US, go “that’s pretty good” and then start ordering different pads to complete the upgrade.

Thanks.

A_COC0NUT · December 13, 2020, 6:04pm

If you want a more neutral and overall less bassy sound, the Lawton pads are rather nice. You can add attenuation rings to get a bit more bass but overall they are much less “fun” than something like the Ori pads which have a bit more bass without rings than the Lawton pads have with rings. Do I would say don’t get the pads unless you intend to use them on SOMETHING down the line.

As a side note, I think the Lawton pads are meant for the TH-900/1.5 tesla more so than the X00S/1 tesla. That’s half the reason I got a set of Lawton pads, to try them in a set of TH-900 at some point in the future.

Delta9K · December 13, 2020, 6:32pm

Interesting, because what I tool from the “tone wheel” is that they type 1 & 2 woods, would be more bass focused. I’m not doubting you. I’m wondering if I am not interpreting the wheel appropriately.

ShaneD · December 13, 2020, 6:40pm

They are. I am in a conversation with mark right now. I thought back in the spring that he told me the 4’s and the 5’s would be bassier. Hopefully he doesn’t mind, but here is what he explained to me about an hour ago:

"Hi Shane, thank you for the additional information, every bit helps.

Re: bass, we listeners always has this conundrum to resolve: you can have fat (but sloppy) bass, or you can have tight, fast bass.

(Or a compromise between them.)

We can’t have cake and eat it too, big fat bass that is also tight and hard firm in texture.

How this relates to our woods, think of them as a continuum.

Type 1 bleeds into Type 2, bleeds into Type 3 etc.
They get their sonic characteristics depending on physical characteristics of the wood.
Type 1 woods are light, soft and low density, high porosity woods have fattest bass,
By the time you get to Type 5, you have heavy, hard, dense woods with low porosity.

Type 1 gives you fattest bass, with least control. Based on initial feedback, this is where I thought you might be heading, if that is top priority go with that.

A Type 5 gives you tightest, harder, most precise, fastest and tuneful bass, at the cost of some bass volume/fatness.
If that sounds good, and is top priority, go with that.

Type 3 gets you in the middle, and that is where mids are emphasized over top and bottom.
For your vocal priority, Type 3 works great.

To maintain some bass fatness, and open midrange, maybe look at Type 2.

Hope that helps"

I am thinking that maybe a 4 might be perfect for me. I do not want big sloppy bass like an Argon.

Delta9K · December 13, 2020, 6:46pm

Thank you for sharing that.

The more time I am getting with the set I have - the more I am impressed and confident that this is where I would like to focus my attention on “building” a set of HP’s. I am so happy that I got these because, I almost bought an Arya new on black Friday and I fear that I would have been bummed if I heard these after…

WaveTheory · December 13, 2020, 6:51pm

My chambers are type 4 (Bolivian Purpleheart - which unfortunately has been discontinued). The bass is plentiful and thunderous, but it’s not sloppy. It’s tight and controlled and miraculously does not bleed into the mids, but it’s very aggressive and forward.

The wood types are also arranged on a loose euphonic - to - analytical scale. If I read the chart correctly, type 1 is the bassy and euphonic grouping while type 4 is the bassy and analytical grouping. Of course, none of my words should replace getting it from the source. Also, from descriptions I’ve heard about Lawton mods, deep, extended, and pretty clean bass is a constant for all the wood types, the chambers vary that by degree but it’s there on all of them - that’s my interpretation based on talking with several people who have experience with Lawton chambers, and my own experience. Take it for what it’s worth (probably not much )

ShaneD · December 13, 2020, 6:53pm

I had pretty much made up my mind to move on, but the option of cups keeps pulling at me. Rather than spend a lot of money on a new set of closed backs, maybe just try some cups…

Hilton · December 14, 2020, 12:50pm

I ordered 4 sets of Lawton Cups a couple weeks ago. They’re in-country now so hopefully arriving in a couple days! (to Australia - for TH610s) I’ll let you know how they sound because I had the same thoughts about moving on to something else but from all the reviews I couldnt really find anything that compares and I’ve already listened to all the top contenders except for the new Focal Radiance…

All Museum Grade except for the Black Limba which is Exhibition Grade.

Wild Ziricote (Type 5 - 1970 / 2200 lbf Janka Hardness)

Wild Ziricote by Hilton, on Flickr