Upgrade from TYGR 300 R , need help

Gaming Audio Competitive
9

Hello, I am on the market to replace my old GSP350 from Sennheiser.
I’m currently considering the

  • Tygr 300 r (with a little amp if needed, like the jds atom or the Zen dac v2, since this headset is cheaper)
  • DT 900 pro x

but I’m not settled and other propositions are welcome too.

Currently, I’m gaming a lot but that’s not the focus of the headset I try to find, but more a second use of it (the imaging and directional awareness is still a concern). I don’t have really any idea where to find good comparisons between the 2 and I m a bit lost.

I really try to find a headset that would be good for when I’m gaming and a great general listening experience when I’m just chilling listening to some good music.

Thanks for your help (first message here)

10

I haven’t listened to them, but the Sundaras are just a bit more expensive than the 900 pro x and well-loved by a lot of people who like to both play games and listen to the music, provided you have a strong amplifier (which is not always very expensive to get, but it takes some looking for), not for loudness but for quality. HE400SE would be the cheaper alternative (generally something to the tune of 75% of the value for 40% of the price, though you can find or two people who believe them to have some advantages over the more expensive model while generally being its weaker version).

A solid choice for gaming and music that’s unlikely to go wrong and that doesn’t need a very strong amp is K702, followed by K612 and (on a good bargain) K712. It’s a legendary headphone that plenty of gamers swear by, judging by my exploratory journey in the last couple of weeks. Not everybody likes them, some people find a lot of flaws to them, but most love them and some are absolutely crazy for them even despite owning more expensive units.

If you’re less into precision aiming for competitive FPS gaming and more into atmospheric soundtracks and such like, one of the gems in the same price bracket is Beyerdynamic’s DT880, which connoisseurs tend to bring up as the most refined BD offering this side of $1000 (or at least 500).

If you’re anal about hearing the music as close to how it was written / what it ‘ought to’ sound like, then Senn 560s should be interesting. If you swap the pads for the ones from HD598Cs or HD569, they reportedly pull a U-turn and become warmer with the bass extending much lower and more of an easy-going/pleasurable listen, somewhat toward HD650 but without losing the larger stage (which should be good for gaming). I supose this could be an interesting option as in kinda like having two different pairs of headphones if you just switch the pads. As far as I can gather, the Senns should be good especially for classical and jazz (and K702 also), at least before you swap the pads. They might be better for that than the Tygrs, but I’m just speculating — haven’t heard them, don’t know much about headphones, only just bought my first pair (Tygrs actually) following lots of reading online and pestering people to help me choose.

If you like some bass, Tygrs and 560s should have more of that than K702, but with K702 you can unlock bass ports with relative ease and that’s supposed to give them a very interesting new character.

Again, I haven’t listened to any of them and am talking just on the basis of what I’ve read and understood (which may be very little and misguided), but the key takeaway here is to read some reviews and comparisons of Tygrs, HD560s, K702, HE400SE and Sundara. Tygrs, 560s and K702s seem to be the safest choices if you can’t listen to them, as well. Whereas HE400SE and Sundara wouldn’t disappoint, but they could disappoint depending on the power and quality of your amp. The stage, especially, tends to open up with stronger amplification on them. With the K702 or the Tygr you won’t have that problem.

And if your top priority is big/open feel plus pinpoint precision without giving up too much on the music front, then according to almost everybody the obvious choice is gonna be Tygr. Probably the best pair for stage + imaging in this price range, plus it allegedly sounds more like a pair of speakers than the typical headphone experience if you’re into more extreme levels of that out-of-your-head feel (in which case these would probably be the best headphones in this price range for that kind of thing).

They Tygrs are also somewhat likely to be the lowest risk of disappointment if you can’t listen to them. For example the 560s could sound too flat and boring if you didn’t like their extreme neutrality; the K702 could have some precision issues or lacking bass depending on what you used them for and what you liked; the planars (400SE and Sundara) could end up having a small stage and imperfect imaging and some other problems with a poor amp. The Tygrs? Well, not everybody will like everything about them, there is always a realistic chance you would like 560s or K702 more (like if mids are extremely important to you and you don’t like them even a little subdued or withdrawn), but again, a lower chance of finding some sort of disqualifying problem with Tygrs. They’re probably some of them most generally agreeable headphones ever made, judging by people’s reactions to them.

Edit: If you want a good price on the Tygrs, go to Beyer’s own store, especially the outlet section. For 560s, I’d probably wait to buy them used, as the pricing on new units can be steep. For K702 used again, as that can get pretty low. But an outlet might be just a little more expensive while giving you warranty.

1 Like
11

Thanks a lot for your quick reply, i will look for the tygr more deeply

12

May want to take a look at my thread. I’ve been given tons of very extensive, very detailed and very patient advice by Falenkor, alphamarshan, MaynardGK and the other gentlemen from these forums, for which I’m very thankful and feel guilty actually for claiming so much attention and time just for myself. It would be great if you could benefit from that too.

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13

I own both but I can feasibly say to take tygr over the 900 unless your wanting a much more mid forward headphone. For specifically gaming I do not encourage 900 solely due to the fact that there is cheaper and better options available… it still works but not as good as headphones like the tygr due to the lacking detail and separation.

In comparison tygr is a subtle v shape signature spin off of the dt 990 meanwhile 900 is more like an open back variant of the dt 880 since it’s extremely neutral and bright. Both share exceptional imaging, 900 drives deeper but tygr has a speaker like signature, however in large intensive gun fights the 900 suffers rather dramatically… I would encourage many others over this headphone if I’m being quite honest and that’s despite the fact that I do enjoy them however I’ll call what I see.

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14

Thanks for your reply, and extensive work on other treads.

I was reading this morning the extensive list and questions on your “guide” about gaming stuff and it was quite a load of information that I’m still processing. But everything is on point as usual with your comments, again thanks for your time and your knowledge.

I have a last question for you. Forgetting the “gaming” side of things, I love a wide soundstage in music (I think like a lot of people, but I don’t have many music enthusiast friends so …). I think that I should just forget about the gaming part and fully focus on finding a great pair of headphone (after all as Crinacle say, headphones don’t make you better).

Current List

So currently my list after all that debate :

  • Tygr 300r

But this one is a bit too much gaming focus in my eyes and I am a bit worried that this would be detrimental to actual music and everyday use, but the cheapest. ( 140€ in Belgium from Bayer directly)

  • DT 880 (250 or 600 ohm) + JDS lab atom

My only concern with this one is the peak on the high end. They seem quite sturdy and well-made, as the majority of Bayer to be honest (sorry that’s why I don’t look too much on Sennheiser since they are quite plastic for me). But the price is quite steep compared to the others… But I would have an AMP after that.
(350€ for the combo Bayer directly + Amazon for the amp)

  • DT 900 pro x

Yes, I know but dam these look soo good and seem like a good upgrade if we put aside the gaming no? And if I’m not miss understanding these don’t need an amp. There seem to be pretty new and I don’t see a lot of reviews about them, or they are pretty mixed reviews.
(245€ in Belgium from Amazon)

  • DT 700 pro x

Yes, it’s a closed-back, but that doesn’t matter too much for me. The soundstage is a bit narrower if I understand correctly, but the reviews on it are quite good too. A bit more V shape and better bass than the 900 pro x, or at least that’s what I understood from the reviews.
(245€ in Belgium from Amazon)

  • Hifiman Sundara

It’s a bit over my budget, but could be a container for a future upgrade (350€ here on amazon), and should need a DAC/AMP to fully use his power right?

  • Hifiman HE400i 2020

On the range of a planar like the Sundara, but at a much more affordable price (200€), but I don’t really know what I could get from a planar. I really don’t have dig enough in the planar space and don’t even know what I would need to drive that type of headset.

DAC AMP

I should add that I don’t have any DAC/AMP at the moment, but the more I dig into this hobby the more I think I should get a decent one (combo or stack), but currently, I don’t have the budget except if it’s absolutely needed. My motherboard has the Realtek® ALC1220 Codec, and this is quite limiting in ohm.

On this side of things, The easier combo to get in a reasonable budget (250€) :

  • JDS lab atom amp+
  • Topping D10s

Since all the Shiit stuff is not available in Europe sadly (at the moment at least)

And on a side note, would the tygr benefit from a DAC ? and would they be drivable with my onboard audio (Realtek® ALC1220)? I have heard that they are a bit hard to drive for a 32ohm.

If you could provide me one last time with your wisdom I would be quite grateful.

Thanks.

PS: sorry for my English, this is my second language and I’m only a student

Edit: rereading this post, I see that I kinda under-grade the tygr, but I think that I’m leaning toward them in the end. Seems like they could provide a good soundstage, imaging, bass response, and pleasant V shape.

15

tygr and 880 are very similar but the tygr needs less power and seems to have less sharpness in the highs

16

they are entirely different in build, tuning, dampening, and quality of sound based on ohms

this remark is beyond false, extremely subjective, and should be thrown out a window. They can make you better due to providing better capabilities and placements while also potentially being comfortable… not to mention a more dedicated mic annoys others less as you don’t sound bad usually either. The headphone won’t make you a god… but providing you the optimal / ideal experience and capabilities can absolutely make you a better competitor

There is zero gaming focus here, its a redone up DT 990 with laser accurate imaging, speaker like presentation, and a warmer leaning Subtle V signature with some recession in the mids. Low ohms making it easier to power, and the usual beyer comfort. It’s not a headset its a headphone marketed towards gamers

880 is a more mid centric neutral bright type headphone, no recession, not the most bass but still around neutral, some brightness but nothing like the 990 or other alternatives. Its worth testing due to its well rounded nature. Its semi open back however creates a more intimate experience instead of that big soundstage… beyer naturally dampens all their headphones which makes a lot of them feel a bit more closed off

shopping around used market will typically yield better results… though I would encourage atleast trying this headphone and utilizing return policies if possible

Short answer? no

claims towards they don’t, in some cases I can tell you they do

Stage is good, depth is good, imaging is good, separation sucks, detail retrieval sucks, too mid forward, a bit on the sibilant side with the vocals due to being pushed into your ear drums, designed specifically for studio use and not for music lovers or gamers, pads are not beveled so larger ears will have pressure on them, there is no current replacement pads, pads will flatten with time. Not particularly one I can recommend really… they sound fine if you can tolerate them but for the price they just are not worth it unless your doing studio work… I would take a sennheiser or DT 880 over these any day of the week

V shape? no, Same signature as the 900 just now with more bass due to close back… and with this comes the same ordeal as the 900. Again, they work fine… just not particularly for anything except studio. Granted, I do prefer 700 more as the extra bass is nice to have… but I would just grab a DT 770 or 177x GO at that point… more so since 177x go for me is close to the same price off used market and it kicks the hell out of this one

it will absolutely need an amp. If your after big soundstage this is definitely one of them… However, if your a bass lover… this will fall short rather quickly due to the bass being recessive. Build quality is also an issue with this company… they are built cheap despite the metal frame and can break rather easily, topped off with a pretty dreadfully bad quality control known to the company. If buying this absolutely make sure you have warranty on this company. Sound wise though these are exceptional just mids and highs being the focus point

skip, 400SE instead. amp wise… same as the entry levels such as atom

would be fine, though I would say you could probably get the atom dac alongside its amp as well.

barely, it just needs enough power. It gains marginal changes from better equipment

the 1220 is rather strong so most likely yes they can be driven ampless, I would check your motherboards specs for the Op-Amps as well as ohms they can drive… usually those boards can drive up to around 200 ohms or so. granted keep in mind onboard will never out pace a dedicated amp and dac and usually will mess with the sound signature alot in this case they will negatively affect tygr and other headphones in some ways

1 Like
17

Agree with @Falenkor that everything else is a sidegrade at that price point. Either up your budget or stick with what you have. 300r is a fantastic headphone for the price point.

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It honestly baffles me a little bit but considering the brand and what headphone the tygr stems from I shouldn’t be too surprised… Hell, DT 880 has a massive cult following and is still one of the best bright headphones in its bracket… Beyerdynamic and Sennheiser definitely know what they are doing when it comes to headphones

19

I have come here not so much looking for an upgrade to the Tygrs but something else to add to my collection. It could sound similar to the Tygrs, it could sound different as I am open to most recommendations. I just want another mid-fi (sub $300 usd) that can be enjoyable at home and “on the go” as it will likely be the headphone that travels with me to college during the day. I would/may take the Tygrs with me but they would have to be outdone by whatever I buy next.

20

@Pegboard You might check out the Oppo PM3. It’s discontinued and I don’t have experience with it myself but I’ve watched a lot of reviews and considered grabbing it a few times to try out as a home/portable solution.

21

I really like the 900 Pro X for MW and Warzone with Oratorys EQ. I’ve also seen that people think of it like a baby of 560s imaging and 1990s audio quality. But are people claiming that in terms of gaming, DT 880 and TYGR are much better for FPS?

22

haven’t tried the 900 pro X but I have the 880 and TYGR they are both very solid I think 880 is the better of the two for a more “competitive” tuning and the TYGR is better for “immersion”

23

Ok. Maybe I’ll try the 880. Should I go for 250ohm or 600? And they seem to be two versions of the 880s, as the earcups have different looks. I have a ifi zen dac to power them.

The TYGR are unfortunately not available in my country, except for a bundle (paired with a external Beyers mic for around 330 dollars).

24

some people say the 600ohm sounds better if you can drive it properly
the 250 ohm would be easier to drive I have the 600ohm and Zen Dac V1 get to around 50% with power match on

25

Hmm, I recently bought the Zen Dac, albeit used, but I’m not looking for a upgrade, so would be 250 ohm then.

26

Hmm i couldn’t get my old zen to run 600 ohm beyers. Software maybe?

27

ever update the firmware or drivers?

28

Yea i did the firmware first thing. High gain at 100% definitely not enough. Curious… defective maybe