I am using a Xinhs 4 core graphene cable on my Timeless today, and I donât hear a difference. That said, the stock Timeless cable is a silver-plated single crystal copper that is foil wrapped, so 7Hz was trying to make a quality cable for this IEM.
I own a few nice cables, but tend to do so because I liked the way they looked, or measured electrically. I own two Xinhs cables, but the blue one I bought to go with my blue Mele was all about how dope it looked. I am happy to report they both sound great too. This one was a case where I wanted to try out graphene and I have, it is interesting and makes for a light cable.
Usually when I can tell the difference, I can also measure it with a multimeter, so while materials matter it is still about their impact on the electrical signal. When it comes down to best value cable for the performance, I still think the Tripowin Zonie is the best deal at $20 for a 16 core silver plated that is very flexible.
Thank you for the input. I have bought a Tripowin C8, cable which I am yet to try out. I am looking at buying a custom Xinhs cable for my Harmonicdyne Zeus with interchangeable connectors, so I am now considering adding a MMCX lead.
Some people claim that silver cables make the sound brighter than copper. If that was actually the case, someone would have a chart with evidence of some frequency shift or tilt. I have never once seen any support for this, only descriptions of sound after changing cable changes.
This is the community where people taped over different holes on the Timeless and posted charts of the results, so this is not asking for new behavior, just more of the same.
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My suspicion is that the new cable is at a different resistance, and if that changed it isnât at the same volume either. At some point this goes back to perception versus measured data. This is why most people say that you need to measure the dB levels for consistency, both on charting and listening tests. HBB even puts a disclaimer about listening at 77dB measured âŠ
If I listen at slightly louder volume the attack times and decay rates can change just a little, and it could impact how people are hearing their music. Maybe they arenât normalizing their listening levels, with a lower resistance cable, the volume is greater, the decay is longer, and higher tones carry longer making it seem brighter.
as long as the cable isnât garbage tier the cable shouldnât make a difference, I havenât noticed any differences between well made $15ish cables and $100ish cables
currently the most expensive cables Iâve got ($50ish) because of the swappable connectors which is pretty convenient
You got that the other way around. Covering the 3 larger vent holes reduces the bass.
If you want Bass increased you need to cover the small nozzle vent. Best is micropore tape for this one, or there will be too much air pressure, it can feel uncomfortable with micropore too though depending on ones sensitivity to such things.
Dont subscribe to metals having specific properties that they bring to each set, but there is a difference with cables in general.
I could distinctly hear a difference between FiiO LS-2.5AS short cable, and Tri Grace 2 core one on i3 Pro IEM. Both are copper but the Fiio being brighter sounding. This was pretty apparent on the i3 Pro, and not to that extent but also noticeable on the Timeless(stock cable vs other Fiio cable - FiiO LC-2.5BS, also a short one)
In the examples above all cables have similar resistance, but the capacitance on the Tri Grace and Timeless stock cable is muuuch higher and very close to each other. Capacitance meaning that the insulator acts as a capacitor. Going from what i know of how capacitors work(in simple terms they charge and smooth out current), higher capacitance will take longer to charge and maybe affect the output impulse somehow without affecting FR. Maybe there is someone who could make more sense of this and have a more detailed explanation, i know that someone is not me .
Timeless stock cable has the capacitance at around 500pF, 5-6 times higher than other cables i have. So for now with my limited sample size im inclined to think that thatâs the parameter that affects the sound, at least with these 2 examples.
Edit:
Btw , the track that i noticed the difference and it jumped in my face on the i3 Pro was Stranglers - Golden Brown.
Just for fun: recorded both Etymotic ER2SE and Timeless with a Sony MDR-EX15AP inline mic.
No EQ applied in either case. Also note that even if I EQ the ER2SE to harman which boosts the treble by 5dB it still isnât sibilant in any way.
Timeless: 189.8 KB file on MEGA
ER2SE: 189.8 KB file on MEGA
The only issue is, if I listen to this on ER2SE (which Iâm doing as Iâm writing this) neither recording is sibilant but if I use Timeless, Timeless is but er2se isnât.
Funny thing though. Neither is sharp when listening to the recordings on ER2SE (with or without EQ that boosts 3-10khz) but only Timeless is when using using Timeless.
In order of most to least sibilant (havenât tested FH3): EX15, Timeless, Starfield, ER2SE/HD560S (neither is sibilant).
And when I say âsibilantâ itâs practically a whistle lol. I also tried pink noise and itâs also noticable there, especially with Harman target EQ and ofc -7dB Q7 (or -6 Q3) at 7k fixes it.
Btw, itâs noticable everywhere but itâs not as pronounced as in this song.
Capacitance doesnât matter that much at the current levels we are using for most of our headphones. Usually, the capacitance we are adding is to make them resistant to oxidation that will degrade the cable in the future, which is a fantastic trade off. IEM cables should not become razor blades.
If you think it sounds better, great for you, but I am a skeptic. I doubt that there is a property that you could hear, that would have no signs or side effects in a FR chart.
The real reason I donât think it matters -
If more or less capacitance did anything detectable, companies would be shouting it from the rooftops trying to sell us all cables with lower or higher values to influence sounds in someway that we might buy the next overpriced one.
I still think if you like the way a cable looks or feels in your hands, you should buy it. I really like the Xinhs 4 core graphene for that very reason.
At what currents are we using our headphones, and at what current level would capacitance matter you think?
Curious to learn more about this. Could you explain to me how does capacitance add corrosion resistance?
Yep its good to be skeptic, saves money :). Maybe youll run into something with very apparent difference that will jump in your face in the future.
Btw havent actually measured to see if there is some measurable difference between them, might do that for science in the next few days. Though im not sure if it can be done perfectly, as with different insertion depth of the iem in the rig, there will be small changes and it would be hard to tell is it because of the cable or because of the insertion. And would be pretty hard to have it 100% exact in 2 measuring runs if you take out the iem to change cable.
They already have what to shout from the rooftops⊠Silver makes it brighter, copper makes it fuller/more wight, so no need to further confuse people with technical stuff. They made it simple to âunderstandâ and corelated color of the metal with the color of the resulting sound :). Which ofcourse i dont subscribe to, as same cable will have different effect with different iems depending on driver configuration and their characteristics.
Though its bit strange that you never heard any difference between any cable/iem combination, what i figured from your comment, correct me if im wrong.
Maybe you just havent tried enough combinations?
I have(burried somewhere) one diy cable that oh soo clearly tames the treble that its impossible not to hear a difference. Was testing it with some lower end chifi at the time.
Oh and Merry Cristmass to everyone that celebrates it on the 25th . Wish you nice holidays.
At higher levels that I would allow wires inserted into my ear canals to be. My Electrical Engineering coursework was 30 years ago, and I have spent most of my career writing software, so I donât pretend to be an expert on the details of this, but I am not new either.
Other way around, it is easy to make a low capacitance cable, but coatings are the standard solution to solve for cable oxidation, and the materials used for the coatings typically add capacitance.
This is still more a community thing that a headphone marketing thing. I should qualify that, I have no ability to read any of the Japanese or Chinese market, so I have idea what claims they make there.
In the west, claiming these things seems like a good way to get into legal trouble, because they would never be able to back it up, because my first point is still true. If it sounds different, it will chart differently, show me the chart.
I suppose your point is backed up by the fact that consumers do dumb things, and Monster Cables still exist.
Have you tried pink or white noise? I actually did it yesterday for the first time and learned itâs the most reliable way. Thereâs definitely a spike at around 7k on my set (a pink/white noise is supposed to sound more or less even with no noticable spikes as I learned and on timeless, with no EQ it sounds like wind + someone is frying something or like rapids + rain). Initially I did -7db at 7k Q7 but after playing around a little and considering a since sweep is quite loud from 6.2-7.2k (I use this at 10% volume Online Tone Generator - generate pure tones of any frequency) I settled on 7k -6dB Q3 (but I use EQ so without it you need like -3 for it to level out sufficiently in a pink noise test).
Now I just have to decide if Iâm willing to accept this as a solution or send it back for testing and repair (HiFiGo told me that if I really want it, it can be done) which is really unlikely because it will likely take ages, not guaranteed to be fixed and itâs also a winner in so many other ways, fit comfort and appearance for one are all excellent.
And considering Iâve been able to reproduce it with a more objective measurement such as pink/white noise as well as record it with a shitty mic where itâs also audible I either have a bad unit, or itâs present on all but not as bad or people that canât hear it arenât sensitive to that or have hearing loss or theyâre in denial.
I just wish that if it was indeed that, there were at least a few others who hear it, preferably in a different spot but not by much (6-8k). The only thing thatâs as bad or worse is Sony MDR-EX15AP but thatâs 20 euros.
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