I doubt it matters on the timeless. Bass is primarily sonic. But I also tried my deep insertion triple flange today and didnāt notice much difference.
On the zen, I think slam does increase because the volume of space being assaulted with air gets smaller. Simple physics.
Seal is always important. Just had a private conversation about super shrieking timeless due to poor seal.
Is that true?? That would be a big No for me for sure. I like the low end to be correctly in line with the rest. In a live acoustic jazz trio you donāt here bass only either. Iād like to relive that experience at home and from reading/watching all reviews plus this whole d#mn thread so far I thought the Timeless could deliverā¦
Take it in context. Thatās on certain songs with a certain setting on a certain amp with certain tips. Given everything lining up just right, it can be a problem for my ears. One thing changes, and itās not a problem anymore.
I have a hard time perceiving ātoo much bassā in any scenario on the timeless. But I want harman tuned bass. If you want a flat line from mids to sub bass, these will have more than that. These sound positively bassy compared to, well, any over ear planar I have heard. And, for me, that is a good thing.
Pick your poison.
@BluJay614 Out of curiosity, can you provide an example song that makes the bass overwhelming for you on timeless? I would love context and to listen for myself.
Thanks all for coming back to me on this topic - much appreciated and I get your points. Howeverā¦
After reading the first 1,000 comments on this thread (plus these last 4) I think the 7Hz my not be my Holy Grail, even though Iāve had planar speakers and know exactly what they can do to the music. Iām having a hard time because of the imaging issue as I listen to small ensembles plus orchestral works a lot, and especially in the latter positioning instruments and groups of instruments is very valuable, I think. So unless thereās someone here spending a lot of time with classical music that can explain me why Iām making the wrong decision, Iām afraid I will move onā¦
If you give me some critical tracks I will compare them tonight between the timeless and my hp-2. The hp-2 has a coherent soundstage and imaging that can surround you. Timelessā¦ doesnāt.
But, on a hunch, I think you are correct. These wonāt be for you.
I rarely listen to classical and have done nothing orchestral beyond show tunes on the timeless.
Guess youāre right. Bummer, as thereās so many things Iām sure I like about them which I wonāt find in dynamic setups or balanced armature. Probably not even in single driver setups (although I do wonder which ones come closest for a sonically balanced experience).
In a previous life (when selling high-end systems) I had the honour to extensively use the Stax Lambda Pro and of course thatās the experience I hope to find, but Iāll necesarilly have to compromise for budget reasons. But if youāre listening to a symphony changing into another part and you have to open your eyes to see whether youāre in the concert hall or in your living room so that you can actually cough, then thereās something pretty decent on your head!
Yeah, itās tough. The timeless are the most āpreciseā headphone I have heard that still has engagement. But, to be honest, that engagement is not likely to matter for classical on anything but the busiest intense tracks. 1812 overture comes to mind. (Not something I listen to on the regular)
And, by memory, classical music is one of the few things that really blew me away on the arya.
I chose toccata and fugue off the fantasia soundtrack because I know it very well.
On the timeless, there is height and width in imaging. So the sounds scurry about the stage. The imaging is quite good. Instruments come from their various locations and are easily tracked around.
I switched to a regular version leopold stokowski and Czech philharmonic orchestra. This is different as they donāt play with the left and right artificially as they do on the fantasia soundtrack.
This feels very much like you are sitting in the orchestra. The harpest is front top left of you. Violinist are mid left and right. Deep horns (oboe maybe?) are bottom right. Everything moves fluidly. But, again, front to back stage is limited. Interestingly itās not zero, but very limited.
During the dueling going back and forth, they are quite obviously chasing each other back and forth.
Switch to hp-2, and the depth appears. So one will be foreground and the other will be pushed back. The benefit for me is it does feel more open. Not so much that the instruments have more depth from each other but that there is more space between me and them. 2nd row instead of sitting in the orchestra if you will.
If the goal is grand concert hall, I honestly wouldnāt take either of these headphones. But in technicals, the timeless wins. The precision of reproduction is exquisite.
Another explanation: Listening to a piano piece on these sounds very much like I am sitting at the piano playing. I own a grand piano and play a little. Not a grand concert hall, but my living room. Not bad, but may not be the goal.
In a concert hall I try to pick row 10 or so to be close enough to hear tiny details but also to be far enough to have a great overview. So initially I liked reading that Iād be separated from whateverās playing as by a wall of glass. But if the projection is flat on the glass thatās not what I like at all. Iāve been wasting months of my life trying to create truly holographic imaging with my previously owned Apogee Duetta Signatures but miserably failed doing so. This made me end up with a (I think it was) $13,000 speaker set that sounded as flat as a pancake and worse than your average bookshelf speaker. I donāt want to relive that part of the hobby
So no, I donāt want to be in the orchestra or at the piano. On a similar note when listening to rock, metal, whatever, I want to hear the singer closer to me than the drummer. I guess this may not be the IEM Iām looking for.
I still decided to read the rest of the thread after post 1,000 and came across your great review. Very well done. Reading the whole frigginā thing costed me about 8 hours I guess, so Iām still a bit reluctant to part from an IEM that I never hadā¦
āI can say the blessing 2 dusk will do this better than timeless.ā
Iām afraid I will have to say No to any IEM that sounds borderline shouty to me. With that I probably rule out 50% of the current market. Add another 40% for having a bass boost and you know how much fun it is to be me
Not my opinion: I HAVE to base myself on the collective musings of reviewers as I canāt try out anything and send it back if I donāt like it while travelling in developing countries. Same for potential fit problems (I have wide ear canals but medium ears at the max). Since I have an āallergyā to anything shouty or nasal if even reviewers repeatedly mention it Iād rather err on the safe side.