Also according to measurements my Samsung Note 3 and the Airist R2R DAC and the Soekris R2Rs should all sound as flat and neutral and natural as ever with no difference whatsoever 
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How about changing this from “Dacs aint shit” to… What dacs aint shit, lol.
What are your picks for the most resolving DACs under 500 and 1000$. Including used DACs.
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Would be pretty hard without knowing the rest of the signal chain, a dac might be great in one system and not in another (I know that might sound stupid but there are times where that’s the case)
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Assuming you start with the DAC and build the rest around it and not the opposite, heh.
there are things that can’t be measured… and graphs don’t tell the whole story, I personally found little difference in DAC’s ($200-$400 range) but still there were differences between some, I imagine it’s very diminishing returns even higher up the scale
I don’t get the point of those high end DACs. If you do proper double blind tests you won’t hear any difference between a perfect measuring R2R and a good Topping or SMSL.
I’d rather spend my money on better headphones/ speakers or things that really make a audible difference
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I used to think that way. I currently own a SMSL SU8, a Schiit Bifrost 2, and a Denafrips Pontus 2 as well as 2 more. There is a vast difference in every one of them! Whether it is blind, double blind or triple, It does not matter as you can clearly hear the difference.
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Did you match the voltage and did a proper ABX test?
I’ve seen many great reviews on Denafrips or Schiit DACs but if they knew what DAC they were listening to the review becomes worthless.
Placebo can be very deceiving in audio that’s why proper tests have to be double blind, volume matched and you have to get it right within the standart deviation
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I have the ability to do that on this system so can do it at any time. I could close my eyes and have somebody flip switches and can tell the difference each time. If you do not hear it then it is your loss. There is a difference definitely. Your ears are letting you down at that point I believe. Everybody hears differently Sir!
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Flipping a switch isn’t blind testing, because there still is bias involved. You have to be able to tell if sample X comes from DAC A or DAC B, similar to the ABX comparer for foobar2000. It’s not easy to do so with hardware like DACs or Amps because you would need some kind of autoamted box to do that, that’s why I asked
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Sir: My opinion is why are you trying to make it difficult? Do you personally hear the difference in Dac A to Dac B? To me this hobby is not about being scientific or anything like that. It is about what sounds good to you and nobody else. Also, everybody has differing opinions as to what is good or bad. If you believe that all dacs are the same then it is your belief and what I tell you should not and cannot dissuade you. I cannot relay to you what I hear as it is MY belief. A Volkswagon and a Ferrari are both cars and will get you A to B but it is more HOW you get there , THAT is the difference in what I hear. And to your last line. Even if you used a silent automated switch that randomly switched between said Dacs you can hear the difference if your ears are trained to pick these subtle changes as easily as swiching from mono to stereo. Experience teaches you this.
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I’m just saying that people should be aware of of things like bias and placebo before overspending money on a DAC which might actually sound the same as the old DAC.
But if you can tell them apart in a blind test you did not waste your money.
All DACs do not sound the same. A 100€ DAC will sound better than a 10€ DAC in most cases.
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Agreed but not ALWAYS better. Different is not necessarily better. Many Dacs within a certain price range will sound similar and it is really only when you step up or step sideways with a different type R2R, Multibit, sigma delta etc. chip based non chip based etc. My biggest was way back when I went from Modi to Bifrost 2 and then from Bifrost 2 to Pontus. 3 distinct levels in this hobby
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I would bet you serious money if you took a Topping or SMSL and did a “double blind” with a Holo Spring 3 KTE or May KTE you could pick it out the majority of the time. It’s a night and day listen. Hell I can pickout my Spring between NOS and the oversampling modes.
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I think there was a comment on this forum in the 660 thread where someone said I thought I could tell the difference between apples and oranges but someone told me I wasn’t doing double blind testing on them right, so I guess I don’t really. Like I don’t need a double blind test to know that my stereo system sounds better than my phone speaker; if the difference is clear enough you just don’t need a blind test to know. It just gets a little absurd. (I even saw a post on Reddit once where someone said they did a double blind test on some cables and did it properly and by the rules and still heard a clear difference, and half the comments were still like ‘you did something wrong’ etc. At some point it’s not a matter of evidence anymore but a matter a faith that cables and DACs and so on don’t matter at all or don’t do the things people say they do.)
I can hear a difference between delta-sigma DACs and multibit/R2R DACs and if you’re the one who’s challenging the truth of my statement maybe do a double blind test yourself, but I know what I hear.
I’m not saying everyone should run out and buy the most expensive DACs and cables and whatever else, go try it yourself and see whether the diminishing returns and whatnot make the trade-offs made sense to you. But at some point telling people they’re not hearing what they’re hearing is just kind of being a dick.
Anyway, here’s Resolve picking out different DACs in a blind test. But you shouldn’t need that to know there’s a difference between DACs when so many people say they’ve heard it.
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I wish more YouTubers would do tests like that. The test resolve did is a bit sloppy tho and not double blind as other people in the comments said.
Golden sound once promised that he will do a proper double blind test with a silent input switcher that was build for him.
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Instead of challenging other people’s experience, why not share yours and why you came to the conclusion you came to. Unless you’re worried others will chime in and poke holes in your methodology?
Differences exist. GREAT differences exist. It’s why people spend thousands upont thousands on a DAC. If you think that a SMSL Sanskrit is all you need, then fine why not just leave it at that instead of challenging everyone else?
And BTW, blind A/B testing with quick switching is the worst possible way to discern difference in DACs. Maybe why you’re unable to hear a difference.
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It has been proven over and over again that quick switching is the best method to compare equipment. You can’t rely on your audio memory at all for comparisons.
And no I am not deaf either.
I don’t want to challenge anyone here.
I just wanted to know if those sonic differences were found in double blind tests.
Those ‚sighted tests‘ are just extremely unreliable and two perfectly measuring dacs (like the holo may and D90 for example) should sound identical.
But as we all know, real audiophiles don’t want to know about science and things like bias or placebo 
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Wait… that’s not what I asked. What DACs have you compared and how did you came to your conclusion? It’s a simple question.
If we’re also counting dongles I compared: Apple dongle, Fiio btr5, chord mojo, smsl Sanskrit, audioquest dragonfly, Fiio K5 Pro and aune X1s.
I did have other dacs in the past but nothing to compare it to at that time.
All comparisons I did were voltage matched.
One comparison I still remember was between the Dragonfly and Aune.
I always thought that the dragonfly has a bit more clarity and even some siblance in the treble but after I did a blind comparison all differences were gone.
That’s where I learned for the first time how important blind tests are.
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